Lafayette Gregory
Les-ter not Ly-Chester
shot through the door???? Really. You guys can bicker among yourselves all day, but --- shot through the door to kill him??? How would they even know who they were arresting without visual verification???????
Wrong address, and another innocent American dies
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I guess JRGreen would rather we all lay down our guns so the Kings men are the only ones with guns. Well news flash they tried that crap in the 1770's and we got a new country and a document called the Constitution from the results of the blood, sweat and tears that many a good man fought for and died for. Now the cops swear an oath to uphold that document and yet it's a man's own fault and not theirs when they violate his own home and kill him because he has a gun in his own home? Perhaps it is time we have another one of them revolutions and hit control alt delete on the big government and the king.
I understand they have to defend themselves too but they have a duty to do their homework and get their address correct and get their facts in order before they do a raid like this, I don't frown upon raids just make sure you got the right address. Mistakes will be made but they need to be held accountable for them plain and simple.
I understand they have to defend themselves too but they have a duty to do their homework and get their address correct and get their facts in order before they do a raid like this, I don't frown upon raids just make sure you got the right address. Mistakes will be made but they need to be held accountable for them plain and simple.
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Just try to imagine Mike Overlay defending crappy mechanic work like JR is defending crappy police work:
"No guys, duct tape is a perfectly viable fix for a faulty timing belt. Y'all just don't understand the challenges we face under the hood."
Mechanics, the thin greasy line.
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"No guys, duct tape is a perfectly viable fix for a faulty timing belt. Y'all just don't understand the challenges we face under the hood."
Mechanics, the thin greasy line.
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"Yeah we foreclosed on the wrong home because the bankruptcy analyst switched a digit in the loan number. You don't know the challenges of a 16 digit number string."
Bankruptcy analyst: the thin dotted line.
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Bankruptcy analyst: the thin dotted line.
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Z
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Let me see, cops on my property without a warrant with my address or name on it?? Trespassing.....
I would have never answered the door. MY policy is to only have friends stop by and if you're my friend you know to call before you come to see if I'm even at home. If I hear the doorbell (or some jackass hollering POLICE!!) I don't answer, period. It tells me that you have no business being at my house and also that you don't know me!! If you don't know me it stands to reason that I don't know you!! And if I don't know you why in hell would I open the door just because you say to??
I got up one morning a little after 0400 to let Lucy out and when I opened the storm door a card fell out onto the porch. Lucy went past and I picked the card up and it was from a local Kannapolis police officer. I called him later to see what he wanted and he said he rang the bell and knocked really hard, how could I not hear him?? I explained that I did hear him but since I wasn't expecting the police I felt no compulsion to answer the door. He wanted to launch off into a lecture but I cut him short and asked again what he wanted. He tried to return to the lecture and I hung up on him. He calls right back and I recognized the number so I didn't answer. He leaves a voice mail and tried to start the lecture all over. Finally toward the end he says he was looking for someone I had never heard of and since I didn't know them I didn't return the call. Last time I ever heard from him.... Case closed.
Just because someone hollers FROG doesn't mean I jump......
I would have never answered the door. MY policy is to only have friends stop by and if you're my friend you know to call before you come to see if I'm even at home. If I hear the doorbell (or some jackass hollering POLICE!!) I don't answer, period. It tells me that you have no business being at my house and also that you don't know me!! If you don't know me it stands to reason that I don't know you!! And if I don't know you why in hell would I open the door just because you say to??
I got up one morning a little after 0400 to let Lucy out and when I opened the storm door a card fell out onto the porch. Lucy went past and I picked the card up and it was from a local Kannapolis police officer. I called him later to see what he wanted and he said he rang the bell and knocked really hard, how could I not hear him?? I explained that I did hear him but since I wasn't expecting the police I felt no compulsion to answer the door. He wanted to launch off into a lecture but I cut him short and asked again what he wanted. He tried to return to the lecture and I hung up on him. He calls right back and I recognized the number so I didn't answer. He leaves a voice mail and tried to start the lecture all over. Finally toward the end he says he was looking for someone I had never heard of and since I didn't know them I didn't return the call. Last time I ever heard from him.... Case closed.
Just because someone hollers FROG doesn't mean I jump......
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"Yeah we gave B00ger a sex change because the lady said it was room one and well, it was actually the room with one guy in it. You don't know the challenges of actually reading the charts to confirm things, that takes too much time"
Surgeons: those with the thin sharp blade.
Surgeons: those with the thin sharp blade.
Like you can't yell Bomb or yell over to your friend Jack at an airport. Lord help you the Police Hit squad will Gun you down, but only if your wearing your Jammie's!
Agreed, about the only action I may take is to arm myself and await their departure of the unwelcome guests.
But back on this topic, @J R Green If they had busted in his home and he had shot a cop and killed them, would you be advocating he be charged???
Hammer12b
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Yep, they never heard of GPS? No one bothered to ar least ride by and check the address? No one had ANY eyes on this target before the raid!?
I have nearly 1000 posts on this forum and over 4000 on the other place and I defy you to show where police actually broke a law and I defended them. Also, while you're at it, find where I ever said that the mere fact that the guy was armed was in any way wrong. Would you like it if people started twisting your words?
You as a retired LEO never learned the elements of trespassing? Walking up to a door is in no means a violation of the law. One could conceivably expect that you have had to knock on a few doors in the middle of the night, yet you chose to forget that. I imagine your old colleagues aren't seeking your advice these days.
OverMountainMan
Cryogenically Hardened Member
You might be surprised how true this actually is. I read a report about police departments who disqualify candidates based on having too-high intelligence.
And that would certainly explain some of the "support" for these scumbag half-wits.
You previously stated this:
Their mistake cost the man nothing. His actions cost him his life
But, I am not trying to be rude or attack you I merely asked you a question. What responsibility do the cops have for knocking on the wrong door?
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None, What you are not understanding here is knocking on the door for any reason doesn't violate the guys rights and doesn't violate any policy. Honest mistakes don't get punished no matter who makes them.
georgel
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Southaven police haven declined to provide a police incident report, and would not comment on the status of the officer or officers involved in the case.
Champion said the address mix-up may have occurred because mailboxes in the area are clumped together.
“There were no numbers on the houses, so when the officers got there, they went to the address they thought was the address they had been asked to go to,” Champion said.
The Pearman house...
Champion said the address mix-up may have occurred because mailboxes in the area are clumped together.
“There were no numbers on the houses, so when the officers got there, they went to the address they thought was the address they had been asked to go to,” Champion said.
The Pearman house...
It was totally an honest mistake when the pharmacist swapped my sons allergy pills with OxyContin. A little over dose now and then isn't a big deal considering the thousands of prescriptions they fill out every week.
Pharmacists: the lab coat wearing line.
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Pharmacists: the lab coat wearing line.
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Thank you, saved me the time.....
Nor on your bowing out of the thread due to a lack of logic.....
So you thought since I was out you could attack me without repercussion? How brave. It's kind of a dick move to attack someone because you think they won't defend themselves.
Did you know that a dictionary isn't a law book? And since my statement said that it wasn't a violation of the law and not a violation of dictionary, who is wrong?
§ 14-159.13. Second degree trespass.
(a) Offense. - A person commits the offense of second degree trespass if, without authorization, he enters or remains on premises of another:
(1) After he has been notified not to enter or remain there by the owner, by a person in charge of the premises, by a lawful occupant, or by another authorized person; or
(2) That are posted, in a manner reasonably likely to come to the attention of intruders, with notice not to enter the premises.
(b) Classification. - Second degree trespass is a Class 3 misdemeanor. (1987, c. 700, s. 1; 1993, c. 539, s. 102; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c).)
doose
Happy to be here
I am not condoning the police shooting this man in any shape or form... in fact, I imagine that there was some over zealousness displayed by the officers in this instance, though I have no proof of that.
That being said, the legal definition of trespass... ie what trespass is in the realm of juris prudence... Trespass to land is a common law tort or crime that is committed when an individual or the object of an individual intentionally enters the land of another without a lawful excuse. Trespass to land is actionable per se. Trespassing has two elements: An actual interference with the right of exclusive possession (called the "entry element"), and intent or negligence. Notably, there is no damage requirement, though pollution and neighbor trespass cases are an exception to this rule (they require a showing of damages).
it is indeed a gray area, as the negligence on behalf of the police department COULD constitute trespass in a court of law.
doose
Happy to be here
whether or not the police were guilty of trespassing, it is plausible to believe that they are culpable for the innocent man's death.
Like many other stories, there are two sides to the story, and things can't be properly sorted out until all of the facts are presented.
That being said, if someone knocks on my door in the middle of the night, police or not, you can bet your ass I will be armed.
Like many other stories, there are two sides to the story, and things can't be properly sorted out until all of the facts are presented.
That being said, if someone knocks on my door in the middle of the night, police or not, you can bet your ass I will be armed.
Obviously they weren't just the threat of death. They killed an innocent man in his own home when he was breaking no laws. It is not against the law to point a gun at intruders. Knock on my door & my pit and a very protective lab answer & that gives me time to prepare to answer the intrusion into my property. The intruder may shoot my dogs but I can guarantee some of them will pay with their lives. You can only push a person so far & do it in the middle of the night on that persons property ain't gonna end well.
Guys, it says right on the package that Duct tape forms an extremely tight bond. So it's perfectly logical to use it for axle repair. You just wouldn't know because you aren't a mechanic.
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Except that their mistake DID cost this man something...his life.
As sanctioned, state sponsored law enforcement officials with the power of life and death, I'd have to say there is a great deal of responsibility for doing the wrong thing...especially when it ends in the death of a wrong person.
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Oh, good Lord!
Even setting aside the obvious fallacy with respect to "no numbers on the house" (as shown in your picture), has this fruitcake who calls himself a District Attorney ever heard of, or lived in, an apartment complex? You know, where all the mail boxes are located in a small roofed pavilion outside a group of apartment buildings?
I SURE hope he continues to make such BS statements, thoroughly documented, of the easily proven incompetence involved here so that if/when this goes to trial over a wrongful death/manslaughter/whatever, they get their keisters handed to them in the form of a HUGE payout to the family for this.
The law says different.
§ 14-34. Assaulting by pointing gun.
If any person shall point any gun or pistol at any person, either in fun or otherwise, whether such gun or pistol be loaded or not loaded, he shall be guilty of a Class A1 misdemeanor. (1889, c. 527; Rev., s. 3622; C.S., s. 4216; 1969, c. 618, s. 2 1/2; 1993, c. 539, s. 17; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c); 1995, c. 507, s. 19.5(d).)
Well, the flip side of the coin is that law enforcement officers are sanctioned by the state to be able to go wherever they need to go in the performance of their official duties.
So posting "No Tresspassing" signs along a property will NOT legally keep the police out in the performance of their official duties.
We can argue the case that this may not apply where they go to the incorrect location, but I don't think that would hold up in court. What will be far more likely to hold up will be some form of wrongful death charge, be it manslaughter or something else.
Z
Zedhound
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I was able to handle you idiotic bullshit up to this point, but you know damn well that doesn't apply to a home invasion, which clearly this was.
That's gonna be a hard one to enforce at my house.
It should be Effin LAW that no LEO leaves the department without a functioning body cam that cannot be turned off or tampered with.
Lol, you remind me of ole Krabba. Slightly twisting people's statements to create a strawman you can attack.
I have generally appreciated your posts because they have gotten me thinking about the police perspective and experience, but when you twist words and hypocritically ignore legitimate questions you kill honest/good faith debate.
I think I have clearly misinterpreted your intentions.
If i'm pointing I've already made up my mind to shoot said intruders.
thrillhill
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Except for police right? Not a crime for them to point a gun at someone if they "feel" threatened?
LOL!
Same laws as "civilians" right? Same standard?
LOL!
What a hoot! These threads are always a barrel of laughs.
You care to show the law on that? Doesn't' a home invasion kind of require some kind of you know... Invasion?
If you can't handle black and white letter of the law maybe you should take a step back and get a snickers.
Z
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Id ask you how you like the tastes of grass, but I hear sheep like grass.