What Qassim Soleimani's killing means

charliedeltajuliet said:
I don’t have a crystal ball to see what will come. So before I get into the “we are going to war in the Middle East again”, I am going step back and see how it plays out. The man is the same that was responsible for the marine barracks that were bombed in the early 80’s, he is behind the recent embassy attack. I heard the Secretary of State saying that this was to sideline an imminent attack that they had intelligence for that he was planning. I for one am glad he is in front of his maker.

After the USS Cole, or the World Trade Center truck bombings if we would have eliminated Bin Laden a lot of deaths around the world (and New York), could have been prevented. Many always fault leadership for not eliminating a terrorist when we have them in our sights, same ones fault us for doing when we have the chance. We did not just cause Iran to declare war on us, they did that decades ago.


At least we aren’t giving them pallets of money.
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Can I like thus again!!!!?
 
Ikarus1 said:
Sure thing. But now they have a coin with his head on it.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...n-coin-following-us-embassy-move-to-jerusalem

We're certainly continuing to fight Israel's wars for them pretty effectively.
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Failing to see significance of this. This coin is not from a mint. first sentence reads "....nongovernmental coin...". I also don't think the events of history point toward us 'fighting' Israels wars for them. They pretty capable themselves. Any wars we have fought that achieve goals of Israel are either (1) mutual benefit or (2) the byproduct of aligned goals, values and interests. We definitely 'support' Israel, whether through money, hardware, or in some cases human assets, but would hardly call that fighting their wars. We do this with every ally and Israel is by far one of our most strategic among them.
 
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Hammer21b said:
In case no one has been watching, we have been at war with Iran since the 1970s! When they took over our Embassy and Carter did nothing, it emboldened them to continuously try to play chicken with the US. They've had their hand in almost every terrorist activity that's been committed for the last 45 or so years! If we don't quit stomping on the ants as they look for mischief and start killing the head cheeses, this will go on forever! They send their minions out to do the dirty work and when they get smacked, no big deal. Start smacking the planners, the department heads, the heads of state that approve this terrorist activity and they'll eventually get the message!
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Go back to when we overthrew their government.

Also, of the hundreds of terrorist attacks in the West from 9/11, not a single one I'm aware of was committed by Shia or backed by Iran. But we're all good with Saudi Arabia, home to Wahhabism/Salafism, the motivating ideology behind most, if not all, jihadi attacks in the West.

Maybe we ought to GTFO of their backyard and worry about policing our own borders?
 
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I’m sick of the pieces of shit Washington DC politicians spending this endless money on the Middle East.

I’m sick of these same people sending these young men on missions where we never make any gains in the region. The young and poor are the gladiators for wealthy men and cheap oil. I’ll gladly pay another dollar a gallon to invest in oil closer to home easily defendable.

Taxpayer money with a massive debt is more important to politicians as they get massive contributions from defense contractors and oil companies.
 
I need gas at about $4 a gallon so I can unload the oil exploration stock my dad bought before he died that is underwater about fifty grand. So yeah, let's boogaloo in the sand so there is something left to inherit. I'm hoping for maybe some Somali to Saudi oil storage facility raids. Some tanker kidnappings would be the icing. Any sort of market panic would be nice.
 
Sigequinox220 said:
We definitely 'support' Israel, whether through money, hardware, or in some cases human assets, but would hardly call that fighting their wars. We do this with every ally and Israel is by far one of our most strategic among them.
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OK. That's why they didn't exist until the 1940s. Where did they all come from? How was that country founded and funded? Israel is the #1 why we are at war in the Middle East, period.
Petroleum is a distant second. Neocons, Globalists, Bankers and Zionists are in lockstep, and business is good.
 
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It's not like we were over there trolling just looking for people to kill. None of this became a thing until the Iran-backed booger eaters started attacking the US embassy, which is sovereign American territory. At that point, I don't care who the f*** we started shooting, killing, bombing, or giving rose petals to.

This guy needed to be gone, he needed to be gone decades ago. I'm celebrating this today.

Have no clue where this is going to go or what's going to happen, but I will say f*** Iran.
 
I'd rather have Israel as an ally than appease Iran in the obviously vain hope that the mullahs will respect the US.

I'd rather we weren't involved in futile wars in the ME. Now that we've achieved energy independence, it seems like a good time to GTFO. Leave the deserts and barren mountain passes to the mullahs - on the condition that they leave us alone. If they don't (when they don't), F that invasion/police action/ pinpoint retaliatory strike BS. Nuke Tehran. If that doesn't send the message, repeat as needed.

It's way past time to face the fact that there is no appeasement of Islam. There will never be peaceful coexistence. It is an ideology set on world domination with 1.4+ millenia of illustrating that goal with action.

Therefore, the only reasonable, logical method of coping with it is quarantine. As long as we don't need something they have and we don't, leave 'em to their own devices. If they encroach on our way of life, crush first, then return to quarantine.
 
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https://www.businessinsider.com/us-israel-allies-2017-2

"Others worry about the balance of the US's aide to Israel. In 2015 more than half of the US's foreign military aid went to Israel. That's about $3.1 billion dollars. Much of this money Israel spends on US defense projects in return. "

It's like saying "my adult step-children living abroad are my financial responsibility".

Let them fight their own damn wars, especially now that Syria is the shithole that everyone already knew it to be.

And as far as Americans with Israeli relatives or ties........ choose a country. My relatives are from Germany but we didn't fight for them when they tried annexing their neighbors by force in 1939.

Just wait til it comes out how wired that new "embassy" is into the Mossad's surveillance network
 
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georgel said:
Meanwhile... Apparently, we've just had a major escalation with Iran. This is an opinion piece, but explained a lot for me.


The U.S. killing of Qassim Soleimani In Baghdad on Thursday ends an enduring threat. At least in the short term, however, it will unleash Iranian retaliation. The leader of the external action arm of Iran's Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, Soleimani long led that regime's efforts to destroy its enemies and expand its revolution.


From an explosive campaign which killed hundreds of American soldiers in Iraq, to supporting Bashar Assad's regime with legions of Shia fighters and IRGC operatives, to conducting a campaign of bombings and assassinations and intimidation across the globe, Soleimani was a master of his very dark arts. He was a serious and continuing threat to American lives and interests. Indeed, Soleimani masterminded a failed 2011 plot to blow up the then-Saudi Ambassador and dozens of diners in a Washington, D.C. restaurant.


Still, Soleimani's killing, apparently alongside Abu Mahdi al-Muhandis, the Kata'ib Hezbollah leader responsible for recent rocket attacks on U.S. forces in Iraq, is striking. Trump might call it justice for this week's attack on the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad, or the recent killing of a U.S. contractor in Iraq, or an act to disrupt Soleimani's plotting against America. Regardless, it illustrates a major strategic escalation in President Trump's Iran policy. Soleimani's standing in Iran and the IRGC in particular makes President Bush's 2008 killing of top Lebanese Hezbollah leader Imad Mughniyeh seem irrelevant in comparison. This is a very big deal.


Trump's shift here is hard to overestimate. Until now, Trump had been keen to keep avenues of diplomatic intercourse open towards Iran. Trump had avoided direct military retaliation against Iran even after it downed a U.S. drone last summer. But this killing slams the door on diplomacy in a most public way. Soleimani was a hero of the revolution and will now be regarded as an heir to Husayn ibn Ali, the martyr of Shia martyrs. Revenge will now rise to the very top of Iran's agenda. A global terrorist campaign of uncertain duration is likely. In the context of Iranian domestic political instability and deep economic pressures on the regime, Iran might also use this killing as an excuse to destabilize oil flows through the Strait of Hormuz. Each of those developments would require immediate American deterrent response.


This will also cause short term strife for American political interests in Iraq. Soleimani and al-Muhandis represented a powerful bloc of Iranian aligned interests. But a bloc that was under growing pressure. They'll now seek to unify erstwhile competitors such as Muqtada al-Sadr into punishing America for what has occurred.


Ultimately, however, the U.S. holds the cards here.


If it is willing to tolerate some U.S. casualties, the Trump administration can effectively out-escalate Ayatollah Khamenei's regime and force it into backing down. But while lives have likely been saved by Soleimani's departure, the near term future next won't be pretty.


https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/what-qassim-soleimanis-killing-means
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No chance it might mean getting out of where we have NO DAMNED BUSINESS BEING? Nah. Didn't think so.

Yes, that creep deserved to die. No problems there. How about we let them go back to gleefully slaughtering each other, whcih they have done for 1900 plus years before we decided we needed to "help" them? What a novel idea!!!
 
Hammer21b said:
In case no one has been watching, we have been at war with Iran since the 1970s!
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bigfelipe said:
It means a new generation of jihadists...
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BU2scwMJL said:
back to war we go...
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Ronsc said:
Was the attack justified....probably....but oh those pesky “unintended consequences”
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MacEntyre said:
wait... when did we stop?

I missed that.
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Schattenreiter said:
When have we ever not been at war with someone?
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BlackGun said:
These countries in the Middle East are never going to be stable nor cease the violence. Time is on their side. If it takes 100 years they are going to continue until they unite into one nation of power. That has always been the goal. Divided they cannot seek ruling the world under Islam.
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REELDOC said:
Those goat humpers have been fighting each other since time begin, they will continue to fight each other when time ends.
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zuerjoha said:
The military industrial complex ain't gonna fund itself!
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BlackGun said:
Taxpayer money with a massive debt is more important to politicians as they get massive contributions from defense contractors and oil companies.
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Our State Department Field Interrogator said when visiting here he was told by a person he was questioning..All you Americans have watches, but We Own the time.

After all, who ever heard of a Moslem holding a grudge??? A century is one tick on their machine.

They hate you and your damn McDonalds, your TVs, cars and everything about you. They despise you.
 
That is all I need to agree that Soleimani was a legit kill

The U.N. special rapporteur on extrajudicial killing on Friday said the President Trump-approved drone strike against Qassem Soleimani, Iran’s top general, violated international human rights law.

In a lengthy Twitter thread, Agnès Callamard said that “outside the context of active hostilities, the use of drones or other means for targeted killing is almost never likely to be legal,” adding that the U.S. would need to prove the person targeted constituted an imminent threat to others.

She also took issue with the justification for using drones in another country on the basis of self-defense.

https://www.foxnews.com/world/qasse...ed-international-human-rights-law-un-official
 
Ikarus1 said:
OK. That's why they didn't exist until the 1940s. Where did they all come from? How was that country founded and funded? Israel is the #1 why we are at war in the Middle East, period.
Petroleum is a distant second. Neocons, Globalists, Bankers and Zionists are in lockstep, and business is good.
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This is not the proper place to elaborate on the intricate history you question, but one does not need to guess the answer. Historians have done the work for us. and I dont think there is a single credible source, historian, security expert, military expert or similar that would arrive at the conclusion that Israel is #1 reason we are at war in the Middle East. Sounds like typical conspiracy fodder. I am in no way saying you are trying to perpetuate conspiratorial uttering, but that you may want to read up a bit more on the matter because the sources you learned from steered ya down a weird path.
 
Sigequinox220 said:
This is not the proper place to elaborate on the intricate history you question, but one does not need to guess the answer. Historians have done the work for us. and I dont think there is a single credible source, historian, security expert, military expert or similar that would arrive at the conclusion that Israel is #1 reason we are at war in the Middle East. Sounds like typical conspiracy fodder. I am in no way saying you are trying to perpetuate conspiratorial uttering, but that you may want to read up a bit more on the matter because the sources you learned from steered ya down a weird path.
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So what is the largest cause of unrest and subsequent us intervention
 
Sigequinox220 said:
This is not the proper place to elaborate on the intricate history you question, but one does not need to guess the answer. Historians have done the work for us. and I dont think there is a single credible source, historian, security expert, military expert or similar that would arrive at the conclusion that Israel is #1 reason we are at war in the Middle East. Sounds like typical conspiracy fodder. I am in no way saying you are trying to perpetuate conspiratorial uttering, but that you may want to read up a bit more on the matter because the sources you learned from steered ya down a weird path.
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I think you may want to read some on the populating of lower Syria, the agreement after the war as to numbers allowed, and the expansion of taking territories since.
 
12151791 said:
In a lengthy Twitter thread, Agnès Callamard said that “outside the context of active hostilities, the use of drones or other means for targeted killing is almost never likely to be legal,”
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Just curious:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/23/us-justification-drone-killing-american-citizen-awlaki

Was she as vocal in her legal interpretation of targeted drone strikes for killing people in other countries back in 2011?

"Lawyers for the Obama administration, arguing for their ability to kill an American citizen without trial in Yemen, contended that the protection of US citizenship was effectively removed by a key congressional act that blessed a global war against al-Qaida."
 
smithnwesley said:
(1) So what is the largest cause of unrest and (2) subsequent us intervention
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In the simplest way without further derailing thread...

(1) Intra-social and inter-regional disparity in a part of the world with lowest educational attainment and low variability of natural resources. The Middle East been a pile of useless violent turd since lonnngg before USA existed, much less Israel.
(2) Americas foreign policy on [at least] both strength projection and conflict escalation
 
Windini said:
Just curious:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/23/us-justification-drone-killing-american-citizen-awlaki

Was she as vocal in her legal interpretation of targeted drone strikes for killing people in other countries back in 2011?

"Lawyers for the Obama administration, arguing for their ability to kill an American citizen without trial in Yemen, contended that the protection of US citizenship was effectively removed by a key congressional act that blessed a global war against al-Qaida."
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BHO could do no wrong in the eyes of the UN
 
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"Muslims" as muslims, do not hate "us." Islam as a religion is one given disproportionately to hatreds and conquest by the sword. However, the person who says that hornets are despicable creatures who will sting you to death given the right opportunity, and then sticks his wang into that hornets nest the way we have done in the ME, is WORSE than stupid.
 
Sigequinox220 said:
In the simplest way without further derailing thread...

(1) Intra-social and inter-regional disparity in a part of the world with lowest educational attainment and low variability of natural resources. The Middle East been a pile of useless violent turd since lonnngg before USA existed, much less Israel.
(2) Americas foreign policy on [at least] both strength projection and conflict escalation
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While this is true, anyone who claims the USA is not fulfilling its role as the foreign policy dept of the Knesset is not paying attention.
 
Sigequinox220 said:
This is not the proper place to elaborate on the intricate history you question, but one does not need to guess the answer. Historians have done the work for us. and I don't think there is a single credible source, historian, security expert, military expert or similar that would arrive at the conclusion that Israel is #1 reason we are at war in the Middle East. Sounds like typical conspiracy fodder. I am in no way saying you are trying to perpetuate conspiratorial uttering, but that you may want to read up a bit more on the matter because the sources you learned from steered ya down a weird path.
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I really enjoyed this podcast http://www.martyrmade.com/fear-loathing-in-the-new-jerusalem/
 
Well then there is the old saw about why are we fighting wars in shit hole countries? So we dont have to fight wars here. Take the fight to them, quickly and without mercy.
 
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jimmyjames8 said:
Well then there is the old saw about why are we fighting wars in shit hole countries? So we dont have to fight wars here. Take the fight to them, quickly and without mercy.
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worked out so well in Korea, Vietnam and Afghanistan (first for the USSR and then for the US). Glad those are resolved quickly and without mercy
 
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tanstaafl72555 said:
While this is true, anyone who claims the USA is not fulfilling its role as the foreign policy dept of the Knesset is not paying attention.
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Most Americans don't have any idea how powerful AIPAC is. Russia buys $200k of Facebook ads and the Dems go berserk for 3+ years. AIPAC owns Congress for decades and . . . :crickets:.
 
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tanstaafl72555 said:
While this is true, anyone who claims the USA is not fulfilling its role as the foreign policy dept of the Knesset is not paying attention.
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Does this not just converge on the notion of mutual benefit? I dont THINK you are claiming something as ludicrous as the worlds richest, most advanced, and well-armed country on the planet is somehow a puppet of a country w/ 8 million people on the other side of the planet. Im fairly certain I know what you mean though, as what you said would, if anything, imply the opposite (they would be our puppet if we were controlling Israeli foreign policy)....We provide a lot of aid, support resources to Israel, no doubt, and that is certainly in our interest. Israel does some thing better than us, more efficiently than us, or has things we haven't developed that are of interest to us--cybersecurity, intelligence practices, weapon systems, respectively, to name a few. All vital to our defense interests. Then there's their cultural values, economic and regional interests and many other areas of philosophical alignment that manifest as pragmatic cooperation between the two.

I think when you compile the volumes of facts [not mentioned here] the best conclusion to be drawn is one of a beneficial symbiotic interaction. I do not see puppetry, shady subterfuge, or infiltration/espionage of foreign governments yada yada....Something tells me we are trying to say the same thing, just the way you worded it makes it sound as though there is some malicious intent by one or the other party, not sure if that was purposeful or not. At the end of the day, they are also one of our most genuine allies. Not an enemy of an enemy is a friend kind of ally (à la mujahideen, Pakistan), pure necessity (South Korea, Japan) or for socio-political appearances (Germany, France). All of the above would flip sides in a heartbeat sucking the Weiner of any new super power that takes our place, or in the case of my historical reference, the mujahideen, even begin to focus on us as an enemy... Israel, Canada, India and UK are probably our only genuine allies. For everyone else its opportunism of some flavor.
 
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Ronsc said:
Was the attack justified....probably....but oh those pesky “unintended consequences”
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I can't help but wonder what the "unintended consequences" of no action would have been. I think we've seen the consequences of sanctions.

Button Pusher said:
Now they are playing the Benghazi game, fact is Trump was at the White House and made the decision, while World Famous JV ex POTUS BHO was in Vegas fundraising and Zero for Two Pant Suit lied about Sid Bluemthal running guns out of Benghazi.
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According the the left, Trump interrupted his golfing for 3 minutes to order the attack.
 
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