Car won't rev over 3000

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random

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This is that same 2011 Dodge Caliber that we replaced the engine on. Finally got it working after a fair amount of drama including a failed starter. Mostly seems to be running ok, but it won't go over 3000 RPM. It's not a rev limiter, it does the same while driving. Also, the response is sluggish, it was having about 1-1/2 second delay when hitting the gas pedal. Replacing the air filter improved that some but it's still somewhat sluggish and still not going over 3k.

We have some suspicions but would like some additional input. Any thoughts what it might be?
 
Is it firing on all cylinders? Running rough at idle? Fuel filter clean?


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random said:
This is that same 2011 Dodge Caliber that we replaced the engine on. Finally got it working after a fair amount of drama including a failed starter. Mostly seems to be running ok, but it won't go over 3000 RPM........Any thoughts what it might be?
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I'm curious why the original engine was replaced. Did it fail in such a way as to overheat and melt down/plug the catalytic converter causing an exhaust restriction?
Unbolting the exhaust after the front pipe before the cat and see if it will rev will confirm or disprove that theory.

Load'em cheap, stack'em deep.
 
RangeSquirrel said:
I'm curious why the original engine was replaced. Did it fail in such a way as to overheat and melt down/plug the catalytic converter causing an exhaust restriction?
Unbolting the exhaust after the front pipe before the cat and see if it will rev will confirm or disprove that theory.

Load'em cheap, stack'em deep.
Click to expand...

Rod blew out the engine block, 2 piston connectors shattered (the part that connects to the crankshaft). Sudden and catastrophic.

Me. said:
Limp mode?
Click to expand...

What is that and how do you address it?

Zbizzle911 said:
Is it firing on all cylinders? Running rough at idle? Fuel filter clean?
Click to expand...

Seems to be on all cylinders, but I'm not sure how to check for sure. It's not running rough. Fuel pump/filter is our current top choice - filter is integrated into the pump so we'll have to replace it all if that's it. Trying to figure out less expensive things that might also be likely.
 
Mike Overlay said:
Its not the fuel pump.
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I agree, not very likely if it was running well enough before the catastrophic failure.
I would be rechecking timing marks (assuming a timing belt), connectors plugged to correct sensors and fully connected, ground strap in place, any codes if the check engine light is on.

Load'em cheap, stack'em deep.
 
Scsmith42 said:
Was the timing belt replaced on the engine? Your symptoms match an engine that has jumped time.
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The replacement engine was from a salvage yard in Raleigh, picked up and installed whole. Nothing like that was messed with.

Me. said:
I don’t know, but I would throw it in the Google mix of any car that won’t run at normal capacity.

The computer kicks in with a limiter when certain conditions are detected.
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That seems to have dug up some possibilities, Seems like a good place to start. Thanks for the suggestion.

For reference here's what happened to the original:IMG_20200112_132716941.jpg

found in the oil pan
IMG_20200126_135151733_HDR.jpg
 
Did you buy it from the exact same year/model/sub model? I swapped engines in a 95 LT1 Camaro with a 97 model lt1 engine. Everything plugged up and the car ran okay but the timing was giving an issue and it had no power lower rpms. After tracking down that the knock sensor was a different ohm than the newer. After that it went back to running strong.
 
throwing any codes?
Go by an auto store and see if they can hook their scanner up to it and see if anything is there
 
I’d check codes first. Things that typically limit power and rpm (other than computer “limp mode) are ignition timing, ignition spark, cam timing, and fuel supply. Fuel supply problems are usually violent under load; ie the engine will buck as it runs out of fuel. Additionally, fuel supply problems manifest themselves differently under full throttle versus light throttle. If you can’t accelerate above 3000 rpm no matter what it’s probably not fuel.
 
Get to the throttle body..........be sure the flap is opening all the way when the accelerator is pressed. Buddy had one get hung at a certain position.....after a good cleaning and lubing....all was good.
 
Timing is off or plug wires are out of order (firing on the wrong cylinder because wire 1 is on cylinder 4 or whatever instead of cylinder 1).


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So it ha 3 "permanent" codes that won't clear, they're obviously pointing at the problem but I'm not sure how to proceed. Found a few things with a search, not completely sure where to go next. Some of what I found seems to be pointing at some of the current suggestions.

Codes are
U1407 "Implausible Engine Torque signal received"
U1424 "Implausible Engine Torque signal received"
(eta: search also shows this as "Vehicle Speed Sensor out of self test range")
U1425 "Implausible Pedal Position signal received"

That point anyone anywhere more specific?

I'm getting from a search:
spark firing order - but I'm as sure as i can be that they're right
timing
throttle body
ETC
 
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……… If you see some type of cable/mechanical way to increase the throttle while under the hood (some older cars were cable controlled), see if you can manually increase the throttle while it's in park. If the car will rev up manually...….that should eliminate any mechanical/timing issues for the engine.
 
Try this relearn procedure for the throttle body. Check accelerator cable is routed properly.
Check both vehicle speed sensors are connected.

 
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Have you disconnected the battery since you've had it running ?
If not, do that.
Then try the re learn.
Maybe try an leave it Idle 15 mins before the relearn after re connecting the battery.
 
Battery has been disconnected several times, but we may try again in a bit.

Trying the relearn, doesn't rev over 3k in park, but we're going to drive it a bit as suggested in the video.

Bowwow - no cable. I can push the throttle itself open a little but not by much, and that requires all air intake assembly to be gone, that's about it.
 
rdinatal said:
Got some news on this. That may be normal. My Escape with CVT did the same.
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Won't go over 3k regardless, that was the big issue to start. After relearn, still won't. Acceleration is lousy, to a dangerous level.

After relearn and driving a couple miles, we now have 11 codes

P0113 Intake Air Temp sensor 1 circuit high - bank 1 (repeated total 3x)
P0365 Camshaft position sensor circuit - bank 1 sensor 2 (repeated total 3x)
P0420 catalyst system efficiency below threshild (bank 1)
P000A Bank 1 camshaft 1 position slow response
U1407 implausible engine torque request signal received
U1424 implausible engine torque signal received
U1425 implausible pedal position signal received

I'm pretty lost at this point, but (a) not sure we can afford to have it fixed and (b) I don't know a mechanic I would trust to fix it. I've already been burned by the only two I know in the area.
 
Scsmith42 said:
Sounds like the replacement engine may not match up to your ecm.
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That would require a new ECM, right?

Any chance that might be PCM?
I can't find ECM for this car, but there is PCM.

We're seriously into the good after bad realm now. :(
 
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If it hasn't ran 100% correct since the donor engine was installed...….Scsmith might be correct. Double check all the wiring harnesses and what not to make sure nothing was missed when the new engine was installed..... no bent terminals.....but is sounds like something from the donor engine isn't agreeing with your ecm.

The donor engine came from the same year/make/model?
 
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@BowWow Engine came from same make/model, different year. According to all I could find, within the same model design block of years (2007-2013) I couldn't find an exact match anywhere moderately local.

I'm WAY out of my depth at this point, and frankly getting rather depressed.

Late last year my son-in-law's Yaris started going bad, I can't even remember the details, but he spent several weeks trying to get it running. It had died on my road, I had to tow it to my yard, where it's been parked ever since. This was in December.

After a lot of trying to get it working, I figured that Throwing parts at an unknown problem is the worst thing you can do as @hp468 says, so I bought the Caliber from a mechanic in the area who I thought I could trust. A week later, the engine blew as you saw (as-is sale so that's that). We got the new engine and had help replacing it from a friends visiting mechanic friend, but we've never been able to get any farther. Yesterday we got it RUNNING, but with the above problems.

In the meantime, he's been driving my truck. He's got no reasonable way to get to work otherwise, but that puts limits on our ability to get around.

I'm at a loss what to do now. Even IF we can get those sensors read, I would have no idea how to fix anything they indicate.
 
And yes, there MAY be something missing - I posted the previous thread about the connector that we can't find the other end for. But we've got nothing indicating what it might be.
 
random said:
Won't go over 3k regardless, that was the big issue to start. After relearn, still won't. Acceleration is lousy, to a dangerous level.

After relearn and driving a couple miles, we now have 11 codes

P0113 Intake Air Temp sensor 1 circuit high - bank 1 (repeated total 3x)
P0365 Camshaft position sensor circuit - bank 1 sensor 2 (repeated total 3x)
P0420 catalyst system efficiency below threshild (bank 1)
P000A Bank 1 camshaft 1 position slow response
U1407 implausible engine torque request signal received
U1424 implausible engine torque signal received
U1425 implausible pedal position signal received

I'm pretty lost at this point, but (a) not sure we can afford to have it fixed and (b) I don't know a mechanic I would trust to fix it. I've already been burned by the only two I know in the area.
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I would think ground wire issue. However, po113 high voltage indicates unplugged sensor more than likely or broken wire.
Po365 camshaft sensor, try swapping with the sensor off the old engine. If no change, back to ground wire issue
Po420, without seeing data stream, I bet the convertor is no longer working
The u codes are more than likely a ground wire issue.
Get a wiring diagram to see what ground (g100, g103 etc) is common to the air intake sensor, camshaft, pcm, body control, instrument modules.
 
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Mike Overlay said:
I would think ground wire issue. However, po113 high voltage indicates unplugged sensor more than likely or broken wire.
Po365 camshaft sensor, try swapping with the sensor off the old engine. If no change, back to ground wire issue
Po420, without seeing data stream, I bet the convertor is no longer working
The u codes are more than likely a ground wire issue.
Get a wiring diagram to see what ground (g100, g103 etc) is common to the air intake sensor, camshaft, pcm, body control, instrument modules.
Click to expand...

I have such a diagram - I have a 5000 page manual with all sorts of details - but I have no idea how to read it. Just looking at one page, it looks like different ground connections for camshaft sensor (K915) vs throttle body (K922)
 
Have you tried using the original throttle body with the replacement engine?
 
Mike Overlay said:
Have you tried using the original throttle body with the replacement engine?
Click to expand...
Did exactly that, just before trying the relearn procedure.

I cleaned it out good before installing it, it actually improved the response a bit, but otherwise all the same. And all those codes are from after that swap.
 
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