Truck gun

Mossberg Lever Gun with a 16 inch barrel and it has a collapsible AR style stock. The 30-30 Leverevolution ammo turns this into a real .308.
So, tiny OAL collapsed and adjustable for stock length. 30 caliber, inexpensive and is truck ready.
 
Probably.

Just think about how many of us put a rifle (or twelve) in a case, lay the case in the back seat, and head to the range...

It’s one of those things that are illegal per the statutes, but there’s a wide spectrum of when it’s enforced.

I had absolutely no idea. I don’t even have a separate compartment for the “trunk” on my Jeep.

Oh well. They can SMDDDDD
 
So at what point is a rifle in a truck NOT concealed?

Lying in the backseat? In a case, not in a case?
 
So at what point is a rifle in a truck NOT concealed?

Lying in the backseat? In a case, not in a case?
Concealed is the midpoint. On one end you have visible, on the other you have stored.

The line between visible (open carried) and concealed seems to be semi-logical. The line between concealed and stored is anybody’s guess.

That’s the main reason mine is now a braced pistol instead of a stocked rifle.
 
So if I’m in the vehicle, it’s in the open, on the back seat, cocked, locked and loaded, we’re good to go.

And if I exit the vehicle to do my grocery shopping and shove it under seat, it’s “stored”.

I’m pretty sure that was probably not the intent of the legislature, but at this point? I’m good with that.
 
Just make sure you can pull it out and set it on the seat if you get pulled... Then it doesn't matter...
 
Just make sure you can pull it out and set it on the seat if you get pulled... Then it doesn't matter...
I have a full sized back seat. I’m talking about parking it right there
 
My truck gun is whatever I am carrying. I have a box in the bed only because of the stupidity of the law. With my CHP I can have a hundred pistols ready to rock stashed all over the cab, but no long guns. Loaded or not.
 
And yes, guns left in cars might have been alright at some point, but appears to be a bad idea nowadays.

I don't think it was ever a good idea to store a gun in a vehicle full time. Arming a thief is one of the reasons. The other is that why would I want to leave something so valuable in a target?

On another forum awhile back some guy had a couple of nice pistols stolen from his vehicle in his driveway. Everyone was like all wee wee wee, sorry you lost such nice guns. Damned thieves! HOW DARE THEY!

I had a hard time feeling sorry for him. Dumbass IMHO.
 
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Just make sure you can pull it out and set it on the seat if you get pulled... Then it doesn't matter...
I generally make it a habit not to go erratically grabbing for guns in my car when I get pulled over lol. Good way to get your butt shot
 
I generally make it a habit not to go erratically grabbing for guns in my car when I get pulled over lol. Good way to get your butt shot

Ever been pulled over? No one said erratic. It's not like cops run up on you. It usually takes them a couple of minutes to get out and start to you. It should be within reach anyway and you should have your essential docs accessible as well. Just casually move it into the open and put your window down and hands on the wheel...
 
Thing to remember about NC transportation laws is if accessible it has to be in the open. If not accessible ie in the trunk, back of a SUV in case or case behind seat of single cab truck. Only with a CHP can you have a concealed PISTOL within the cab of the truck that is accessible. Hence why people use AR/AK pistol as their vehicle gun when out and about. I do take mine in at night.

CD
 
If you put a rifle on the B post, suspended from your shoulder strap anchor, with a plastic flower in the barrel, most folks will not notice it, and it is inaccessible to the driver.

The best way to lose a gun is to leave it in a vehicle.
 
I guess this is the motivation to pick up an upper and a brace. I’ve got everything else I need. What’s optimum barrel length and gas system for 5.56 in a pistol length to run properly? All I know is rifle.
 
I guess this is the motivation to pick up an upper and a brace. I’ve got everything else I need. What’s optimum barrel length and gas system for 5.56 in a pistol length to run properly? All I know is rifle.

My preference is carbine length gas and a 11.5in barrel.
 
I guess this is the motivation to pick up an upper and a brace. I’ve got everything else I need. What’s optimum barrel length and gas system for 5.56 in a pistol length to run properly? All I know is rifle.
For carbine length gas system, 10.3" is the shortest. Gas port should be .070" and run a H2 buffer. SOCOM figured that combo out 20 yrs ago. These are select fire and run great here in Afghanistan. Only difference is the stock vs brace.


IMG_0411.jpg IMG_0421.jpg IMG_0561.jpg

My pistol at home, again difference is only FCG and stock/brace.
IMG_9269.jpg

One other note, if building a pistol ensure that the lower started as a pistol/firearm (stripped) and not built as a rifle. Once a rifle, always a rifle according to ATF. If you use a receiver that first had a stock on it when you bought it then add a short barrel, you have made a unregistered SBR. A pistol is always a pistol even if you attach a stock to it and barrel over 16". It can be converted back to a pistol but remove stock first and add brace., then short barrel.

CD
 
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I have a 7.5 or 8.0 inch. I had to add a linear muzzle break due to extreme noise. Never less than 1o.5” for me on a future AR.
 
One other note, if building a pistol ensure that the lower started as a pistol/firearm (stripped) and not built as a rifle. Once a rifle, always a rifle according to ATF. If you use a receiver that first had a stock on it when you bought it then add a short barrel, you have made a unregistered SBR. A pistol is always a pistol even if you attach a stock to it and barrel over 16". It can be converted back to a pistol but remove stock first and add brace., then short barrel.

CD
That’s not entirely true as it’s written. Your intent may be different than that, though.

It’s perfectly legal to by any new lower and build a pistol. Doesn’t matter if it’s stripped, or complete with a brace or stock. You just have to remove the stock before attaching the short upper.

Without a barrel attached, you can’t have a rifle...and thus can’t have a “weapon made from a rifle”. All lowers (stripped/braced/stocked) should transfer as an Other Firearm unless there are local/state laws that say otherwise. And there aren’t in NC.
 
So if I’m in the vehicle, it’s in the open, on the back seat, cocked, locked and loaded, we’re good to go.

And if I exit the vehicle to do my grocery shopping and shove it under seat, it’s “stored”.

I’m pretty sure that was probably not the intent of the legislature, but at this point? I’m good with that.

This is my understanding after speaking to my local DA, a local Judge who convicted someone of a concealed rifle in a truck, at local lawyer and my local LEO. In order to be charged for having a concealed long gun in the cab of a truck, SUV, station wagon, jeep etc... the it first must be concealed and secondly it must be accessible. It doe not have to be loaded. It is my understanding that ammo also has to be accessible. Loose rounds or boxed rounds are less accessible than say a load magazine. The accessible part is where the rubber meets the road.

If you are pulled over with a long gun in the car and the officer discovers it they will make a determination if the gun is concealed and accessible. The NC statute is not explicit as to the definition of accessible. I was at a dinner party with a local judge and a lawyer who is also a member of the NC House and they were discussing a case where the Judge convicted a woman of a concealed rifle in a truck. The lawyer was the defense lawyer in the case. The gun was in a soft padded case with loaded magazines on the floor board of the truck behind the passengers seat. The lawyer argued it was not accessible. The judge said it was. The women was convicted.

So I asked what in that situation would make the gun inaccessible. I was told that a simple luggage lock would have changed the determination in that case. I also later asked local LEO and my local DA about the same type of scenario. I was told that in my local jurisdiction it would be unlikely for me to be charged if the gun was not loaded and it was clear I was headed to the range. They advised not to have any loaded magazines. Both agreed that a simple lock would put you in a stronger position if you were charged and brought to court. They also advised depending were you were traveling within the state some LEO will interpret the statute differently.

My issue with the statute is that you are at the mercy of a individual LEOs judgement and then most likely the judgement of a local DA and Judge. Lots of wiggle room for too many people. I generally only transport long guns in the trunk of a car or with a lock on the case inside my truck. YMMV

That’s not entirely true as it’s written. Your intent may be different than that, though.

It’s perfectly legal to by any new lower and build a pistol. Doesn’t matter if it’s stripped, or complete with a brace or stock. You just have to remove the stock before attaching the short upper.

Without a barrel attached, you can’t have a rifle...and thus can’t have a “weapon made from a rifle”. All lowers (stripped/braced/stocked) should transfer as an Other Firearm unless there are local/state laws that say otherwise. And there aren’t in NC.

Yes make sure your FFL transfers as other. It does not matter if it has a stock, carbine tube, grip etc... It is other until you attach an upper to it. It is my understanding that once you place a rifle upper and a stock onto the lower it is then a rifle forever and cannot be turned back into a pistol. A pistol however can be converted into a rifle and then turned back into a pistol.

I guess this is the motivation to pick up an upper and a brace. I’ve got everything else I need. What’s optimum barrel length and gas system for 5.56 in a pistol length to run properly? All I know is rifle.

I went with 11.5" because of reliability and because of sound and muzzle blast. I found it to be a more enjoyable shooter but my understanding is that 10.5" is the shortest one can go and get rock solid reliability. That is not to say people don't have shorter guns that run 100% just that at 10.5" and above the odds are in your favor. If you are looking for a SBA3 Brace I have one for sale. It is brand new in the box. I mounted it but did not shoot with it. I ended up going with a SBA4. Shoot me a PM if you are interested. With all the craziness these days they are out of stock in a lot of places.
 
Yes make sure your FFL transfers as other.
Yes, and no.

A paperwork error by the FFL, and not caught by you, doesn’t change the type of firearm. They should mark is as other. But if they don’t, it doesn’t change what it is.

If you bought an 870 and the FFL checked Handgun...you still bought a Long Gun. If you bought a Glock 19 and they checked Long Gun, you still bought a handgun. Having it correct sure would be nice...no disagreement there.


(BTW...the rest of that paragraph was good, so I didn’t include it to prevent any confusion)
 
Yes, and no.

A paperwork error by the FFL, and not caught by you, doesn’t change the type of firearm. They should mark is as other. But if they don’t, it doesn’t change what it is.

If you bought an 870 and the FFL checked Handgun...you still bought a Long Gun. If you bought a Glock 19 and they checked Long Gun, you still bought a handgun. Having it correct sure would be nice...no disagreement there.


(BTW...the rest of that paragraph was good, so I didn’t include it to prevent any confusion)

That is also my understanding that an error in paperwork will not get you in trouble but if you have a good relationship with your FFL it is always best to remind them how to list it. ;)
 
For carbine length gas system, 10.3" is the shortest. Gas port should be .070" and run a H2 buffer. SOCOM figured that combo out 20 yrs ago. These are select fire and run great here in Afghanistan. Only difference is the stock vs brace.


View attachment 228476 View attachment 228477 View attachment 228478

My pistol at home, again difference is only FCG and stock/brace.
This is my understanding after speaking to my local DA, a local Judge who convicted someone of a concealed rifle in a truck, at local lawyer and my local LEO. In order to be charged for having a concealed long gun in the cab of a truck, SUV, station wagon, jeep etc... the it first must be concealed and secondly it must be accessible. It doe not have to be loaded. It is my understanding that ammo also has to be accessible. Loose rounds or boxed rounds are less accessible than say a load magazine. The accessible part is where the rubber meets the road.

If you are pulled over with a long gun in the car and the officer discovers it they will make a determination if the gun is concealed and accessible. The NC statute is not explicit as to the definition of accessible. I was at a dinner party with a local judge and a lawyer who is also a member of the NC House and they were discussing a case where the Judge convicted a woman of a concealed rifle in a truck. The lawyer was the defense lawyer in the case. The gun was in a soft padded case with loaded magazines on the floor board of the truck behind the passengers seat. The lawyer argued it was not accessible. The judge said it was. The women was convicted.

So I asked what in that situation would make the gun inaccessible. I was told that a simple luggage lock would have changed the determination in that case. I also later asked local LEO and my local DA about the same type of scenario. I was told that in my local jurisdiction it would be unlikely for me to be charged if the gun was not loaded and it was clear I was headed to the range. They advised not to have any loaded magazines. Both agreed that a simple lock would put you in a stronger position if you were charged and brought to court. They also advised depending were you were traveling within the state some LEO will interpret the statute differently.

My issue with the statute is that you are at the mercy of a individual LEOs judgement and then most likely the judgement of a local DA and Judge. Lots of wiggle room for too many people. I generally only transport long guns in the trunk of a car or with a lock on the case inside my truck. YMMV



Yes make sure your FFL transfers as other. It does not matter if it has a stock, carbine tube, grip etc... It is other until you attach an upper to it. It is my understanding that once you place a rifle upper and a stock onto the lower it is then a rifle forever and cannot be turned back into a pistol. A pistol however can be converted into a rifle and then turned back into a pistol.



I went with 11.5" because of reliability and because of sound and muzzle blast. I found it to be a more enjoyable shooter but my understanding is that 10.5" is the shortest one can go and get rock solid reliability. That is not to say people don't have shorter guns that run 100% just that at 10.5" and above the odds are in your favor. If you are looking for a SBA3 Brace I have one for sale. It is brand new in the box. I mounted it but did not shoot with it. I ended up going with a SBA4. Shoot me a PM if you are interested. With all the craziness these days they are out of stock in a lot of places.
Yes, and no.

A paperwork error by the FFL, and not caught by you, doesn’t change the type of firearm. They should mark is as other. But if they don’t, it doesn’t change what it is.

If you bought an 870 and the FFL checked Handgun...you still bought a Long Gun. If you bought a Glock 19 and they checked Long Gun, you still bought a handgun. Having it correct sure would be nice...no disagreement there.


(BTW...the rest of that paragraph was good, so I didn’t include it to prevent any confusion)
Thanks for this guys. @wvsig I could be interested in the brace, but after checking Aero Precision for a complete upper their cupboards are bare. I’ll be checking PSA next. If I can’t find an upper I won’t need the brace.
 
LGS had a good deal on Mossberg Maverick shotguns a few years ago. With a sling and a butt cuff of extra shells, I felt like it would be all the truck gun I'd need. I have an AR pistol I've also considered for the role, but I think I'd like to go a different direction with the current upper on the gun.
 
The issue with the shotgun is same as the rifle. It can’t be concealed in NC and covered by a CHP. :(
 
This is my pistol setup. I just got a Larue MBT-2S which I will install tomorrow.


Sehz5Bz.jpg
 
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This is my pistol setup. I just got a Larue MBT-2S which I will install tomorrow.


Sehz5Bz.jpg

Looks lime my Barnes pistol. Just installed a LaRue but haven’t shot it yet. Feels very nice in dry fire. For a pistol that isn’t a target or competition gun it seems like a no brainer.
 
Looks lime my Barnes pistol. Just installed a LaRue but haven’t shot it yet. Feels very nice in dry fire. For a pistol that isn’t a target or competition gun it seems like a no brainer.

At $80 it is a no brainer upgrade from a Milspec trigger. I have them in almost all of my AR15s. I like the SSA but it is 2X the price. I have it in a Colt 6920 with the old large pins. It was one of the only upgrade trigger I could get at the time. I shoot both equally bad. LOL
 
Yes make sure your FFL transfers as other. It does not matter if it has a stock, carbine tube, grip etc... It is other until you attach an upper to it. It is my understanding that once you place a rifle upper and a stock onto the lower it is then a rifle forever and cannot be turned back into a pistol. A pistol however can be converted into a rifle and then turned back into a pistol.
For the sake of argument, wouldn't this then be a bit of a Schrodinger's Cat kinda instance? Could we argue that all 'others' are pistols, as you can't prove that a pistol upper wasn't put on at some point before a rifle upper was put on?
 
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For the sake of argument, wouldn't this then be a bit of a Schrodinger's Cat kinda instance? Could we argue that all 'others' are pistols, as you can't prove that a pistol upper wasn't put on at some point before a rifle upper was put on?
For that matter, if you always initially install the upper when there’s no stock installed, it doesn’t start as a rifle in the first place. :D
 
In other news, it would be nice if PSA sent an order confirmation email the same day they charge the credit card.

Maybe they got the order.
 
For the sake of argument, wouldn't this then be a bit of a Schrodinger's Cat kinda instance? Could we argue that all 'others' are pistols, as you can't prove that a pistol upper wasn't put on at some point before a rifle upper was put on?

You can argue anything you want in court in front of a judge. IMHO a paper trail and documentation are always helpful. Clearly YMMV.
 
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