GRNC
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MadMan4Ever
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Now this is the correct way to critique GRNC, with well typed statements in polite fashion that can be answered. I salute you.
The reason we advocated school carry with special training is because that could have been passed with enough support & blanket carry for anyone wouldn’t be.
I’ve had my permit for years & had loads of training so I forgot what basic beginners CCP class was even about until I sat in on one when my GF wanted to get her permit... suffice to say it’s not even close to basic firearms instruction & nobody can convince legislators with straight face that it is.
Sure your dad may have taught you how to blast soda bottles when you were a child, but lots of folks didn’t have dad’s growing up & they really need more than 8-hours of legal training before handing them a gun & sending them on their way.
We don’t advocate for stringent training for everyone because the second you do, the left makes the training near impossible to obtain, exorbitant prices, etc...
However school carry with extra training might have passed.
MadMan4Ever
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The only thing I can think of that you might be talking about is when the horrid NC Sherrifs association tried to coerce Danny Britt into turning NC back to “may issue” instead of our current “shall issue”.
Britt seemed to genuinely believe he was helping gun owners, not realizing the Hezbolla’ish NCSA
were playing on wording most might miss. As for being easily irritated, I confess my fuse is short anymore. 55+ hour work weeks + parenting + never ending leftist news coverage & then being criticized for comments made by others has me on edge.
It says a lot that I now have to send folks to other forums vs this place.
MadMan4Ever
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Burt Gummer
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I now have to send folks to other forums vs this place.
Because GRNC didn’t hold up their end of the advertising bargain and their space here got pulled? Or because the GRNC rep didn’t know how to deal with folks and now makes excuses as to why?
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So you literally recommend folks to “others along those lines” that are owned by Canadian anti gun companies? This is why you get the negative attention. You’re the only one who can’t see that you bring it upon yourself.
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MadMan4Ever
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There are others but I’m not going to post them here so the anti’s can follow over to there & continue the GRNC hit pieces.
But yes, I’d sooner take my chances with a Canadian owned site than send folks here now.
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Then maybe you should go to one of those sites and stay away from this one. Ya know, since we're all idiots here.
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Lol they’ll see through the idiocy soon as well. Good luck to you
MadMan4Ever
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As I said earlier, only reason I chimed in here is a notification I got.
My memory stretches back to the first thread where folks were mad over the RINO costume, to Paul’s angry response that he had someone else post for him since he doesn’t do online forums.
I didn’t post it for him because I didn’t agree with his comments, figuring he’d simmer down & all could be made well but someone else posted it instead of thinking.
I spent a very long time trying to defuse situation but it honestly got to where I think the majority of folks wanted to have an excuse to be angry & do nothing vs actually having to do something.
It’s easy to sit at home & watch Mel Gibson in “the patriot” while holding your M4, but giving up a whole weekend several times a year is hard..
For the record, I made this error once, I told a mod, who I was too stupid to realize was a mod AND a friend of mine to “buzz off” and it landed me a nice temporary ban. So...no do this.
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Yeah. I do give up several weekends every year (as do several others) to volunteer for things I love and believe in (this forum)
NOT HARD AT ALL
There is one member in particular that does this as well and he travels more than to just his local venue.
@Jeppo drives more miles to volunteer than anyone here to support this home
As long as we dont spew off at the mouth about not needing nor wanting new members this place will continue to grow with or without you or your recommendation to join us to have a decent place to meet.
Now this is the correct way to critique GRNC, with well typed statements in polite fashion that can be answered. I salute you.
The reason we advocated school carry with special training is because that could have been passed with enough support & blanket carry for anyone wouldn’t be.
I’ve had my permit for years & had loads of training so I forgot what basic beginners CCP class was even about until I sat in on one when my GF wanted to get her permit... suffice to say it’s not even close to basic firearms instruction & nobody can convince legislators with straight face that it is.
Sure your dad may have taught you how to blast soda bottles when you were a child, but lots of folks didn’t have dad’s growing up & they really need more than 8-hours of legal training before handing them a gun & sending them on their way.
We don’t advocate for stringent training for everyone because the second you do, the left makes the training near impossible to obtain, exorbitant prices, etc...
However school carry with extra training might have passed.
Take the first statement to the other person and then read your statements. This has always been the problem imo. It's ok if others can be polite and well spoken. But the first little bit of push back from other members and it goes out the deep end on your side of it making it worse for all. There are several strong opinions and several jerks. It's always been my understanding that half the people are going to think your right and half are going to think your an idiot. It's best not to open your mouth and make the entire room think your wrong explaining anything. Sometimes you come off worse than people had thought about you and that's when complaints happen.
@Oyster
So you are now seeing what some of the negativity is about. I will say that I appreciate that GRNC has stepped up to log the time necessary to push gun rights. As an example they threatened/brought legal action against counties that would not change their park signs to be compliant with gun laws that had become more gun friendly than the laws were at the time the signs were made. To my knowledge, nobody else is doing that groundwork specifically in NC, and this is why they get some of my money.
As said elsewhere, I find some of their tactics inappropriate. I don't use their "email your rep" template, but I appreciate they notify me of the issue as they perceive it. I don't always perceive the concern the same way they do, but that is true of every organization I follow.
They also take the time to put together a voting guide based on responses to gun rights questions. This takes a lot of time, and again I don't know of anyone else doing this on behalf of NC gun owners.
I think of them as well-intended. They sometimes act as if a hammer is the best choice of tool for every problem, even when people are politely telling them they should consider a screwdriver for this problem.
I also think they are thin-skinned when it comes to listening to gun owners thoughts as opposed to telling gun owners what they need to do.
All that said, they get some of my money based on what they actually accomplish in NC.
So you are now seeing what some of the negativity is about. I will say that I appreciate that GRNC has stepped up to log the time necessary to push gun rights. As an example they threatened/brought legal action against counties that would not change their park signs to be compliant with gun laws that had become more gun friendly than the laws were at the time the signs were made. To my knowledge, nobody else is doing that groundwork specifically in NC, and this is why they get some of my money.
As said elsewhere, I find some of their tactics inappropriate. I don't use their "email your rep" template, but I appreciate they notify me of the issue as they perceive it. I don't always perceive the concern the same way they do, but that is true of every organization I follow.
They also take the time to put together a voting guide based on responses to gun rights questions. This takes a lot of time, and again I don't know of anyone else doing this on behalf of NC gun owners.
I think of them as well-intended. They sometimes act as if a hammer is the best choice of tool for every problem, even when people are politely telling them they should consider a screwdriver for this problem.
I also think they are thin-skinned when it comes to listening to gun owners thoughts as opposed to telling gun owners what they need to do.
All that said, they get some of my money based on what they actually accomplish in NC.
np307
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Since it hasn't been mentioned, I'll walk through the ordeal that first alerted me that GRNC might have some problems. This was back on one of the canadian boards.
They came out hard against Troxler, AgSec, over some captive deer farms. Tried to spin it into something about deer farms hurt hunting and hunting involves guns, so technically its a gun rights issue. Not a huge red flag at first, except for the fact that they had previously given the excuse about not getting involved in some other issues that it wasn't directly related to gun rights so they wouldn't touch it. All became clear later on that year when, after another attack of Troxler (who I don't particularly care for), a GRNC higher up ran for office. What office you might ask? That's right, AgSec. They ran two hit jobs over off-message issues in order to try to put one of their guys in office.
Later on, over another issue (still at a canadian site), I saw the bad side of PV in full force when he started telling people who had reservations about a policy that GRNC supported that we needed to "remember who brung us to the dance" and that he didn't need us, he was the biggest dude in town and the Gen.Assembly feared him. I think this was over their endorsement of Tillis, but can't remember exactly. It may have been a sheriff endorsement.
I wish that I had all the details, but this was several years back. I had it all in a series of PMs with someone over there, but they purged PMs apparently and I lost it. Couple that with what happened here, as others have mentioned, and I don't have much love for GRNC. And for goodness' sake I'm tired of hearing the line "if it weren't for GRNC we wouldn't have concealed carry." They were an important player that we should be thankful for, but that doesn't mean the organization is currently one I want to support.
All that to say, I think that the organization had a time and a place where it was beneficial, but it's too top-heavy now. They haven't been effective in NC since probably 2014.
They came out hard against Troxler, AgSec, over some captive deer farms. Tried to spin it into something about deer farms hurt hunting and hunting involves guns, so technically its a gun rights issue. Not a huge red flag at first, except for the fact that they had previously given the excuse about not getting involved in some other issues that it wasn't directly related to gun rights so they wouldn't touch it. All became clear later on that year when, after another attack of Troxler (who I don't particularly care for), a GRNC higher up ran for office. What office you might ask? That's right, AgSec. They ran two hit jobs over off-message issues in order to try to put one of their guys in office.
Later on, over another issue (still at a canadian site), I saw the bad side of PV in full force when he started telling people who had reservations about a policy that GRNC supported that we needed to "remember who brung us to the dance" and that he didn't need us, he was the biggest dude in town and the Gen.Assembly feared him. I think this was over their endorsement of Tillis, but can't remember exactly. It may have been a sheriff endorsement.
I wish that I had all the details, but this was several years back. I had it all in a series of PMs with someone over there, but they purged PMs apparently and I lost it. Couple that with what happened here, as others have mentioned, and I don't have much love for GRNC. And for goodness' sake I'm tired of hearing the line "if it weren't for GRNC we wouldn't have concealed carry." They were an important player that we should be thankful for, but that doesn't mean the organization is currently one I want to support.
All that to say, I think that the organization had a time and a place where it was beneficial, but it's too top-heavy now. They haven't been effective in NC since probably 2014.
What the heck happened in here?
Only comment I will make in this thread.
1. OP, if you ask for an opinion accept it as an opinion and don't criticize the other person for telling you their opinion.
2. OP, if you came here to troll just move along, we have zero tolerance for that here
3. For you others, chill out. This is the internet. The person you are bashing may have just been diagnosed with a deadly disease, or just lost a loved one, or may be drunk or they just don't give a big flip.
We have to be able to disagree without being disagreeable. United we stand, divided we will fall.
We have a good thing here, let's don't blow it.
over and out
Only comment I will make in this thread.
1. OP, if you ask for an opinion accept it as an opinion and don't criticize the other person for telling you their opinion.
2. OP, if you came here to troll just move along, we have zero tolerance for that here
3. For you others, chill out. This is the internet. The person you are bashing may have just been diagnosed with a deadly disease, or just lost a loved one, or may be drunk or they just don't give a big flip.
We have to be able to disagree without being disagreeable. United we stand, divided we will fall.
We have a good thing here, let's don't blow it.
over and out
What I do know is many politicians, campaign managers, and volunteers who back NC gun rights see him as a hard working man and use the word patriot to describe Paul. That’s what is important. He has the ears of decision makers. He keeps people informed of new bills. Politicians give him face time.
Same is true of this site. Both are doing great things for our great state. Both are doing more than the beloved NRA who just refuses to enter the battle. The internet is not a place to resolve differences. You do that face to face like a man.
My personal view of Paul Valone would not be important. There are lots of people I do business with I would not socialize with. My dad fought for men’s rights on child custody and gun rights locally. Not many liked him but when the mention of his name came up they used words like respect and persistent.
Same is true of this site. Both are doing great things for our great state. Both are doing more than the beloved NRA who just refuses to enter the battle. The internet is not a place to resolve differences. You do that face to face like a man.
My personal view of Paul Valone would not be important. There are lots of people I do business with I would not socialize with. My dad fought for men’s rights on child custody and gun rights locally. Not many liked him but when the mention of his name came up they used words like respect and persistent.
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DCGallim
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Unfortunately, your response deflected to an issue I did not mention.Now this is the correct way to critique GRNC, with well typed statements in polite fashion that can be answered. I salute you.
No, I was not referring to any proposal for school carry. My reference was to Senate Bill 708 of 2015 (Homeland Security Patriot Act) which proposed a "Homeland Security Unrestricted Concealed Carry Permit" which would have granted an entitled few the same carry privileges as on-duty LEOs.
- ... a person who is issued a permit pursuant to this Article may carry a concealed handgun anywhere in the State, including property on which a notice is posted prohibiting the carrying of a concealed handgun, and has the same exemption from all State prohibitions and restrictions regarding the carrying of a concealed handgun that State and local law enforcement officers have when acting in the discharge of their official duties.
- The sheriff shall issue a permit and a badge to a person who qualifies for a permit under this Article.
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Dale Gribble
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BS.
The folks HERE are more pro-RTKBA and pro-liberty than ANYONE you will find on ANY OTHER forum ANYWHERE.
and for the snide “hit piece” remark...
It’s really not a “hit piece” if it has been earned.
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The meme had nothing to do with you, it was to make the rest of us laugh, and it did.
We knew this thread would become heated three pages in less than 24 hours.
This is a great place, with LOTS of knowledge and sarcasm. I’ve met multiple folks, have a few new friends. There’s only 3 on line personalities I don’t think I’d want to break bread with, I could be wrong there as well.
Welcome aboard
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Say One bad word about her and I'll......why You....I oughta!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I had a relative that once started out making tacos and wound up with spaghetti.So you have heard how bad my cooking is.
I think the kicker was when she took the stuffing out of the turkey on Thanksgiving and tried rinsing it under water in the kitchen sink because she didn't like sage and wanted to get the taste of it out.
LolI had a relative that once started out making tacos and wound up with spaghetti.
I think the kicker was when she took the stuffing out of the turkey on Thanksgiving and tried rinsing it under water in the kitchen sink because she didn't like sage and wanted to get the taste of it out.
...the kicker was when she took the stuffing out of the turkey on Thanksgiving and tried rinsing it under water in the kitchen sink because she didn't like sage and wanted to get the taste of it out.
That has to be the funniest kitchen blunder I have every heard about. Thanks for the laugh.
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This is the last post I will make on the subject, now that I'm at a computer and can type this out. This is my opinion.
When GRNC first started I thought they were a passionate group and probably deserved my support. Passionate people can accomplish great things and have the ability to inspire others to join their cause. Things like threatening to sue counties for not removing gun buster signs from parks was seen as harsh by some but I saw it as a step in the right direction. Use the laws and the courts against the law makers who didn't want to follow the law. You see, passionate people can be bulldogs but their main focus is always their goal, whatever that is.
But passionate people do not usually set out to embarrass the opposition or make enemies of them. Sure it happens sometimes. They inspire others to join the cause and they try to incorporate those peoples ideas to help further the cause. Most passionate people do what they do because to them it is the right thing to do, while they want people to support them they aren't doing it for you, they are doing it for themselves and/or their families and their children.
It became clear to me, after the Rhino costume incident (which was de facto a pink vagina hat for gun owners) that they weren't passionate, they were fanatical. Fanatics are passionate but the difference is that they are more focused on the fight than the results. They demand that you recognize that they are fighting for you and make the mistake of thinking they are the only ones doing the fighting. They will not tolerate anyone questioning the decisions or directions of their group or their leaders.
That is as reasoned a post as I can make on the subject.
When GRNC first started I thought they were a passionate group and probably deserved my support. Passionate people can accomplish great things and have the ability to inspire others to join their cause. Things like threatening to sue counties for not removing gun buster signs from parks was seen as harsh by some but I saw it as a step in the right direction. Use the laws and the courts against the law makers who didn't want to follow the law. You see, passionate people can be bulldogs but their main focus is always their goal, whatever that is.
But passionate people do not usually set out to embarrass the opposition or make enemies of them. Sure it happens sometimes. They inspire others to join the cause and they try to incorporate those peoples ideas to help further the cause. Most passionate people do what they do because to them it is the right thing to do, while they want people to support them they aren't doing it for you, they are doing it for themselves and/or their families and their children.
It became clear to me, after the Rhino costume incident (which was de facto a pink vagina hat for gun owners) that they weren't passionate, they were fanatical. Fanatics are passionate but the difference is that they are more focused on the fight than the results. They demand that you recognize that they are fighting for you and make the mistake of thinking they are the only ones doing the fighting. They will not tolerate anyone questioning the decisions or directions of their group or their leaders.
That is as reasoned a post as I can make on the subject.
This perfectly describes the behavior we saw out of them after the rhino suit incident.
YES! It IS hard...but yet a lot of us still do it. And some more than just a few gun shows a year. (or the time equivalent - 2 days)
I respect you for working hard, but I dont think you should think youre special because you volunteer with GRNC.
A lot of folks work hard to educate and spread pro-2A, it's not just Paul and his disciples.
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There’s thread for that. This one is derailed enough