Conceal Carry Sign Violators

NCFubar

NCFubar

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I got into a discussion with a new CHP holder and the question of what is the punishment for violating a posted “no firearms allowed” sign? He said his instructor said it was just treated as a trespass and that’s it. A couple years back after all the changes (especially the 2013 revisions) I retook the CHP class from an instructor who is actually a LEO and was taught it can be treated as an “Infraction” and punishment is a fine or you can turn in your CHP in lieu of paying the fine.

Referring to NCGC 14-415.11.(c)(8) & NCGS 14-415.21.(a) are what I have been going by but I am not an attorney nor do I stay at a Holiday Inn Express ...

§ 14-415.11. Permit to carry concealed handgun; scope of permit.

(a) Any person who has a concealed handgun permit may carry a concealed handgun unless otherwise specifically prohibited by law. The person shall carry the permit together with valid identification whenever the person is carrying a concealed handgun, shall disclose to any law enforcement officer that the person holds a valid permit and is carrying a concealed handgun when approached or addressed by the officer, and shall display both the permit and the proper identification upon the request of a law enforcement officer. In addition to these requirements, a military permittee whose permit has expired during deployment may carry a concealed handgun during the 90 days following the end of deployment and before the permit is renewed provided the permittee also displays proof of deployment to any law enforcement officer.
(b) The sheriff shall issue a permit to carry a concealed handgun to a person who qualifies for a permit under G.S. 14-415.12. The permit shall be valid throughout the State for a period of five years from the date of issuance.
(c) Except as provided in G.S. 14-415.27, a permit does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun in any of the following:
(1) Areas prohibited by G.S. 14-269.2, 14-269.3, and 14-277.2.
(2) Areas prohibited by G.S. 14-269.4, except as allowed under G.S. 14-269.4(6).
(3) In an area prohibited by rule adopted under G.S. 120-32.1.
(4) In any area prohibited by 18 U.S.C. § 922 or any other federal law.
(5) In a law enforcement or correctional facility.
(6) In a building housing only State or federal offices.
(7) In an office of the State or federal government that is not located in a building exclusively occupied by the State or federal government.
(8) On any private premises where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the premises.
(c1) Any person who has a concealed handgun permit may carry a concealed handgun on the grounds or waters of a park within the State Parks System as defined in G.S. 143B-135.44.
(c2) It shall be unlawful for a person, with or without a permit, to carry a concealed handgun while consuming alcohol or at any time while the person has remaining in the person's body any alcohol or in the person's blood a controlled substance previously consumed, but a person does not violate this condition if a controlled substance in the person's blood was lawfully obtained and taken in therapeutically appropriate amounts or if the person is on the person's own property.
(c3) As provided in G.S. 14-269.4(5), it shall be lawful for a person to carry any firearm openly, or to carry a concealed handgun with a concealed carry permit, at any State-owned rest area, at any State-owned rest stop along the highways, and at any State-owned hunting and fishing reservation.
(d) A person who is issued a permit shall notify the sheriff who issued the permit of any change in the person's permanent address within 30 days after the change of address. If a permit is lost or destroyed, the person to whom the permit was issued shall notify the sheriff who issued the permit of the loss or destruction of the permit. A person may obtain a duplicate permit by submitting to the sheriff a notarized statement that the permit was lost or destroyed and paying the required duplicate permit fee. (1995, c. 398, s. 1; c. 507, s. 22.1(c); c. 509, s. 135.3(e); 1997, c. 238, s. 6; 2000-140, s. 103; 2000-191, s. 5; 2005-232, s. 3; 2011-268, s. 14; 2015-241, s. 14.30(cc).)

§ 14-415.21. Violations of this Article punishable as an infraction.

(a) A person who has been issued a valid permit who is found to be carrying a concealed handgun without the permit in the person's possession or who fails to disclose to any law enforcement officer that the person holds a valid permit and is carrying a concealed handgun, as required by G.S. 14-415.11, shall be guilty of an infraction and shall be punished in accordance with G.S. 14-3.1. Any person who has been issued a valid permit who is found to be carrying a concealed handgun in violation of G.S. 14-415.11(c)(8) shall be guilty of an infraction and may be required to pay a fine of up to five hundred dollars ($500.00). In lieu of paying a fine the person may surrender the permit.
(a1) A person who has been issued a valid permit who is found to be carrying a concealed handgun in violation of subsection (c2) of G.S. 14-415.11 shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.
(b) A person who violates the provisions of this Article other than as set forth in subsection (a) or (a1) of this section is guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor. (1995, c. 398, s. 1; 2011-268, s. 21(a); 2013-369, s. 16; 2015-195, s. 9.)


What have you guys been taught?
 
I don't remember what I was "taught", but the stories I've been told usually end with some form of, "Sir, if you could please leave the premises with your gun." This usually follows the question, Are you a valid permit holder?

This includes embarrassing events such as dropping the gun out of the waist band and kicking it while trying to pick it up. :D
 
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Well what I was taught is now different from the law as far as punishment. it was a low misdemeanor when I took my class back in 11

Not sure what is trying to be got at here lol. Violators (if caught) of carrying a firearm where they aint suppose to is a fine and nothing more.

Concealed is concealed is concealed. If no fuss is made about it why bother beyond that.
 
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You answered your own question. Walking past a no carry sign is a civil infraction, not a crime. Pay the fine or surrender your CHP and that's all there is to it. No misdemeanor, no felony, no "criminal" violation.

The trespass come into play when a property holder asks you to leave (because you're carrying or you smell funky) and you refuse. If you leave when asked, you're still liable for the infraction of carrying past the posting.
 
^^This.
I mean do what you want. That's all on you and I don't really care.
But if you get nailed for this, and gotta pay the fine, what happens when you go to renew your permit? Is it on the line then since 'you can't be trusted' to play the game?
Yeah it's a game with stupid rules, we all know that. But like NASCAR...maybe you try to add an extra 1/2 inch to the spoiler for more down-force and traction. Maybe you get away with it. Maybe you don't and get thrown out of the race. But it don't stop there. After that you're on the radar and get picked apart at every race.

Is concealed still 'just' concealed at the courthouse? How far do you wanna take it?

I'm with the camp that says just go someplace else. Take the fight to a higher playing field than the street.
 
Friday said:
^^This.
I mean do what you want. That's all on you and I don't really care.
But if you get nailed for this, and gotta pay the fine, what happens when you go to renew your permit? Is it on the line then since 'you can't be trusted' to play the game?
Yeah it's a game with stupid rules, we all know that. But like NASCAR...maybe you try to add an extra 1/2 inch to the spoiler for more down-force and traction. Maybe you get away with it. Maybe you don't and get thrown out of the race. But it don't stop there. After that you're on the radar and get picked apart at every race.

Is concealed still 'just' concealed at the courthouse? How far do you wanna take it?

I'm with the camp that says just go someplace else. Take the fight to a higher playing field than the street.
Click to expand...

Each man has to make his own decisions on how far he will go to protect himself and his family. I may be of the camp the practices, unless there is a metal detector that I can't beat. I am going to carry. If anything, we have seen this past couple of weeks, waiting on trained help to come save you may or may not happen.
 
I don’t want to disarm ever, but guns are not the only self defense tools out there. Just sayin’
 
This was a question more about what is being taught to people newer to concealed carry than what we’d do. It bothers me that there are people out there calling themselves “instructor” who teach erroneous information that can put someone into a bad situation. Honestly I do not put much faith in the CHP class as a whole but the legal portion doe not to be on point to keep a new CHP holder from getting in trouble (and thus making the headlines).
 
Firemedic54 said:
Each man has to make his own decisions on how far he will go to protect himself and his family. I may be of the camp the practices, unless there is a metal detector that I can't beat. I am going to carry. If anything, we have seen this past couple of weeks, waiting on trained help to come save you may or may not happen.
Click to expand...

I agree entirely. I may take a different approach than others but you're right, it's ultimately a personal decision.
My argument, well..not really an argument but position is..do you really need to go to a business that doesn't want you there to begin with?
"Well my kids like the juju beans they sell and it's the only place that sells them."
"They sell the best coffee."
"It's the only place that offers item xyz and that's my favorite."
"It's where Mickey Mouse is."

That's my query. I find that most often it's a decision that boils down to some kind of convenience factor that is not at all necessary for quality of life, but rather quantity of life.
Forgive me in advance if I appear judgmental. The written word is sometimes lacking and that's not my position. I don't know every scenario that my fellow Patriots find themselves in, and I can't make a blanket statement as to what they need to always do. I do know that most of the guys here don't take things lightly, and therefore must cede the ultimate decision to them.
 
NCFubar said:
This was a question more about what is being taught to people newer to concealed carry than what we’d do. It bothers me that there are people out there calling themselves “instructor” who teach erroneous information that can put someone into a bad situation. Honestly I do not put much faith in the CHP class as a whole but the legal portion doe not to be on point to keep a new CHP holder from getting in trouble (and thus making the headlines).
Click to expand...
My CHP instructor was a complete tool. Spent most of the time going on & on about how you should carry 3 guns. Primary, back-up, and back-up to the back-up.
Legal information was terrible. Best was when he brought in a State Trooper who proceeded to inform everyone that it's illegal to take a gun into anyplace that sells alcohol, like Wal Mart. Said Trooper also informed everyone that if he pulled you over on "his highways" and you had a gun, you'd better keep your hands on the wheel and beg for mercy or you were gonna be in a world of s**t. He was also going to disarm you and probably cuff you if necessary to insure "everyone's safety".
You shoulda seen the noobs and womens faces. They were in shock and just wondering what the hell they got themselves into.
 
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