OK, I'll check the timing...who knew??? As for the trigger, why do I need a new spring? It pulls fine and is easy to pull.....
Not sure I'm going to spend $400, unless I really fall in love! Lol.The CZ75 was the original. The CZ75B was the same gun with some minor changes and a Firing pin Block (so the hammer can't be hit causing an unwanted discharge).
They are ergonomic guns that fit a lot of different hands. I think the one downside for small hands is the long reach to the trigger for the first DA pull. After that the trigger resets itself into SA mode and the reach is shorter.
CZ's in general can be had for as low as $400.00 (basic carry guns) all the way up to nearly $4000.00 (hi end competition guns). So they have guns for every budget.
Not sure I'm going to spend $400, unless I really fall in love! Lol.
But I appreciate that you'd let me come fire someguns...lol.
Someone once told me my mind was so wide open it was a wonder stuff didn't fall out! Lol. I'm pretty sure as I've aged, more stuff has fallen out more frequently!!!That is why we refer to this forum as a community.
There is always someone ready to help with whatever you need. There is always someone willing to answer questions. There is always someone that will help guide new shooters to firearms that suit them. There is always someone willing to let you try before you buy.
I'm actually glad to see you taking such an interest and trying to learn new things. Open minds are the best minds.
You aren't missing anything. The internals of most firearms are fine...but just like car people gun people like to "fix stuff". The trigger kits, spring kits, and all that jive help...but help in a way that is like adding 50 horsepower to a car that already has 400 more horsepower than you will ever need.Yeah...watched the spring kit video....no. The trigger is fine, to me. I can pull it just fine. No sense me messing around with that stuff! Maybe in 50 years if a spring wears out? My heirs can do it! That's why I'd replace the springs, right? If they wore out or something went wrong with them?
Am I missing something?
Thanks for that! I'm probably not going to do stuff unless it needs to be done to fix something. Lol. Right now, I think cleaning my guns is pretty advanced stuff! (Well, not on the revolver, but taking apart something to clean it!)You aren't missing anything. The internals of most firearms are fine...but just like car people gun people like to "fix stuff". The trigger kits, spring kits, and all that jive help...but help in a way that is like adding 50 horsepower to a car that already has 400 more horsepower than you will ever need.
If you shoot often, or compete, or just like "stuff" then things like that are great. No arguments against them really.
Not until its done then reversed would you miss it.Yeah...watched the spring kit video....no. The trigger is fine, to me. I can pull it just fine. No sense me messing around with that stuff! Maybe in 50 years if a spring wears out? My heirs can do it! That's why I'd replace the springs, right? If they wore out or something went wrong with them?
Am I missing something?
The P01 omegas are out there, that would give the benefits of the lighter alloy frame, the ability to swap safety and decocker, and a rail if OP needed a light or laser.There is the COMPACT, which is steel and has a safety, and the alloy-framed compacts, which have decockers. I've had a couple of Compacts (steel with safety), but found them heavier than I cared for. \
The new Omega compacts (I've seen them discussed, but not for sale yet) would give you the smaller (compact) size with the lighter alloy frame, and your choice of safety or decocker. That would be an awesome gun.
RE: CZ-75 vs. CZ-75B...
As others have noted, they're basically the same gun, but the B series (and almost ALL are Bs) means there's firing pin block.
I've had a bunch of pre-B's (what CZ enthusiasts call the original CZ-75 series of guns) and even more B models. The pre-Bs as you get into the 1990s become almost identical to the B models (which were a later stage of evolution for the same gun), except for the finish, the sight dovetails, the grips, and a few smaller parts. The polycoat finish is durable and can be touched up with matte black auto body paint; the older finishes are paint, and not worth warm spit. They also made nickel-plated models, and high-gloss blued ones, too. (I've still got an 85 Combat in satin nickel, and have had several in high-gloss blue -- but now avoid all high-gloss finished.)
The earliast CZ-75s had a quirky safety -- if you find one with a safety lever with a pin-hole in it, put it down and run away. There's a spring inside the lever that must be controlled (with a pin or toothpick) if you remove the safety... and if you don' t it goes walkabout, and replaements aren't available. Kadet Kits -- an generally unknown .22 conversion kit won't work on all older (pre-B CZs), which have wider hammers, and a few other parts are different. Most pre-Bs won't accept newer hi-cap mags unless you open up the grip mag channel with a flat file. Finding mags can be an issue, otherwise.
My 85 Combat, fitted with a Kadet Kit, would outshoot my Ruger Target Competition (a government model with slab sides and the LONG barrel), so I traded the Ruger away. I still have a Ruger MKII .22, but not an expensive one.
I gave up on pre-Bs a long time ago, as anything they can do can be done with the 75B series with a little gunsmithing work. (The CZ Forum [http://www.czfirearms.us/] has great how-to tips and has members and participants who really know their stuff, including the head of the CZ Custom Shop, and David Milan, who runs Cajun Gun Works.) The original design, which has a more-oval trigger guard, is more attractive -- along with a spur hammer. CZ introduced a RETRO MODEL a few years back that LOOKED like a pre-B but was a 75B. One of those would be a great find!
I've kept my CZ-85B, a CZ P-07, a custom AT-84s (which was an almost clone when introduced, made in Switzerland), and a Sphinx SDP. These are all great guns.
Look around for a USED CZ-75B to get into the family, and then worry about upgrading or moving on to a better CZ. (Some of their IPSC-type guns are almost pornography). There are a lot of nice guns available from the factory, from the CZ Custom Shop, or from Cajun Gun Works.
Just don't go to Hyatt's to buy a CZ. They have the PCR compact that has a MSRP of $599 priced at $699!
Not to hijack the thread, but I never gave them a second look before, really. You guys had been blabbing on about how they eject gold shell casings and such, so I fiddled with one at the gun show. Handles well and points well. There are just so many variations to that cz full size pistol... I'd not know where to start. They look like they are 5-600 bucks or 1700.00.
I handled/shot Chikin 's tanfoglio, which I assume is like a cz, and it was a sweet shooting experience.
So, why did you chose the Shadow vs. another version….Its a nice looking gun!I am waiting on a Shadow 2 to get to my local FFL. It will reside with my 75B and P01. I went with the Urban Gray. I liked the look and it was cheaper than the Black or Standard Shadow 2 with the blue grips.
Thanks. Not really worried about size or weight. I actually want a heavier gun to keep the "snappy" factor down...have been bruised by a really !light gun recently. Lol. I'm spending time getting information on lots of guns, hoping to get my hands on as many as possible to see how they feel and how the recoil is.There is the COMPACT, which is steel and has a safety, and the alloy-framed compacts, which have decockers. I've had a couple of Compacts (steel with safety), but found them heavier than I cared for.
The new Omega compacts (I've seen them discussed, but not for sale yet) would give you the smaller (compact) size with the lighter alloy frame, and your choice of safety or decocker. That would be an awesome gun.
So, why did you chose the Shadow vs. another version….Its a nice looking gun!
Just don't go to Hyatt's to buy a CZ. They have the PCR compact that has a MSRP of $599 priced at $699!
Tanfoglios are clones of CZs, so yeah they are similar, and from everything I have read can be pretty darn awesome in their own right.
As far as the naming and all that, I admit it can be kinda odd at first, but so is learning the difference between a G17, G19, G26, G30, G22, G23, and so on. Ive actually found that once I looked into it their naming conventions actually kinda make sense...a CZ 75 D Compact PCR is "CZ (Company) 75 (Year of design) D (Decocker) Compact (size) PCR (Police Czech Republic). B models just mean there is a trigger Block if you see that in the name...
Other CZ Pattern guns, which include the Sphinx and a number of newer offerings from Turkey, are all variants, mostly of the Tanfoglio pattern -- and there's not a lot of interchangeability between the Tanfoglio-based guns, either. The Chinese (Norinco) version of the CZ may be a true clone, but you can't get it in the U.S.
Sphinx, SphinxArms, and several other companies based on the original Sphinx organization tried to make it work over the years, and just couldn't make it happen profitably. Throughout the process, however, the quality remained high, and the current SDP versions were re-engineered to allow greater use of automated production methods -- rather than the relying on so much hand work during production
The SDP that you and I own was produced using the new technology and equipment, and hopefully KRISS will be able to produce them with the same high level of fit and finish. As you say, it seems "unfortunate" but the only other option was to close down the business and not build the SDP at all. I hear from Kriss reps from time to time, and they haven't thrown in the towel, yet.
I was offered a chance to buy a full-size model a year or so ago, and I just couldn't come up the necessary dollars to make it happen, even though I would have gotten it at a good discount. (I haven't decided whether I missed a chance or made a good move. -- as the full-size guns are beautiful weapons. And they would've been cheaper than than a new P-210 series gun.)
The "B" means firing pin block. I'm sure that's what you meant. And the naming convention doesn't tell you whether the frame is steel or alloy or the SIZE of the frame. (the capital "C" Compact model has a steel frame, while the other metal compacts use alloy frames.)
There haven't really been "true" CZ clones since the late 70's. (ITM in Switzerland made some true clones called the AT-84, but the later AT-84s -- I have a custom model -- were based on the Tanfoglio version of the design, which is subtly different and NOT a clone.
The Tanfoglio guns (are. as you note, pretty darned awesome) are based on the CZ pattern, but there's almost nothing that can be interchanged between the Tanfoglio guns and the CZs except, in some cases, magazines. How the hammer is sprung, how the firing pin block works, the size of pins, the sight dovetails, even the way the slide fits on the frame, are all different. The large-frame Tanfoglio guns, which include the Witness models imported by EAA, have smaller grips than do the CZ large frame guns.
Other CZ Pattern guns, which include the Sphinx and a number of newer offerings from Turkey, are all variants, mostly of the Tanfoglio pattern -- and there's not a lot of interchangeability between the Tanfoglio-based guns, either. The Chinese (Norinco) version of the CZ may be a true clone, but you can't get it in the U.S.
Love those old short rails!It should also be noted that there were two early versions of the CZ75, one with a thinner "Browning nose" & short slide/frame rails. Then there is what many here in the west consider the "Original Pre-B CZ-75" with it's full length slide rails and heavier "Browning nose". It was designed approx. 1979 or thereabouts, as a more durable modification that is intended to give longer service life of both the frame's fore end and the slide's fore end. It is more common outside of Europe .
Like so:
Early CZ-75 w/ short slide/frame rails
Later so-called "Original Pre-B" version with longer slide/frame rails & heavier slide.
It should also be noted that there were two early versions of the CZ75, one with a thinner "Browning nose" & short slide/frame rails. Then there is what many here in the west consider the "Original Pre-B CZ-75" with it's full length slide rails and heavier "Browning nose". It was designed approx. 1979 or thereabouts, as a more durable modification that is intended to give longer service life of both the frame's fore end and the slide's fore end. It is more common outside of Europe .
Like so:
Early CZ-75 w/ short slide/frame rails
Later so-called "Original Pre-B" version with longer slide/frame rails & heavier slide.
[/QUOTE/]Love those....very nice!
Love those old short rails!
Offhand, I can't think of any advantage to having a non-original short-railed CZ-75. As I understand it, CZ went to longer rails and a slightly different frame design because extended use of the orignal design led to frame damage. (More recently, maybe in this discussion, I saw slide damage mentioned, too.)
Just having one for looks may be fine -- if the CZ Custom version is structurally sound, but I doubt that I'd bother. I'd rather spend the extra money on performance upgrades or get one of the CZ IPSC-style guns or try a P-09 tarted out with all of the CZ Custom or Cajun Gun Works performance options.