Does NC Law Supersede Local Ordinances Against Concealed Carry In Local Parks and Playgrounds?

NC Farmer

NC Farmer

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My granddaughter was with me and my wife earlier today and we were riding around near Wilsons Mills in Johnston County when she saw a public children's playground and asked us to stop the car. We were the only people around so we stopped and let her run and play for awhile. I went under the picnic shelter and I noticed a posted sign that stated concealed weapons were not allowed per Wilsons Mills statutes. I ignored the sign and went about my business thinking that my state honored right to conceal carry supersedes the local authority in this case since it is a public recreational facility. Was I wrong in my thinking?
 
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NC Farmer said:
I ignored the sign and went about my business thinking that my state honored right to conceal carry supersedes the local authority in this case since it is a public recreational facility. Was I wrong in my thinking?
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You're not wrong in terms of the State pre-empting local municipalities from passing more stringent gun laws. There is some verbiage in the state statutes about parks and "recreational facilities" though I don't know off hand if it applies to your situation or not and even if it did, I would very likely play the concealed means concealed card.
 
I believe that counties/municipalities are permitted to prohibit carry in parks that are operated by the county/municipality even if you otherwise qualify by state statute.
 
§ 14-415.23. Statewide uniformity.

(a) It is the intent of the General Assembly to prescribe a uniform system for the regulation of legally carrying a concealed handgun. To insure uniformity, no political subdivisions, boards, or agencies of the State nor any county, city, municipality, municipal corporation, town, township, village, nor any department or agency thereof, may enact ordinances, rules, or regulations concerning legally carrying a concealed handgun. A unit of local government may adopt an ordinance to permit the posting of a prohibition against carrying a concealed handgun, in accordance with G.S. 14-415.11(c), on local government buildings and their appurtenant premises.

(b) A unit of local government may adopt an ordinance to prohibit, by posting, the carrying of a concealed handgun on municipal and county recreational facilities that are specifically identified by the unit of local government. If a unit of local government adopts such an ordinance with regard to recreational facilities, then the concealed handgun permittee may, nevertheless, secure the handgun in a locked vehicle within the trunk, glove box, or other enclosed compartment or area within or on the motor vehicle.

(c) For purposes of this section, the term "recreational facilities" includes only the following:

(1) An athletic field, including any appurtenant facilities such as restrooms, during an organized athletic event if the field had been scheduled for use with the municipality or county office responsible for operation of the park or recreational area.

(2) A swimming pool, including any appurtenant facilities used for dressing, storage of personal items, or other uses relating to the swimming pool.

(3) A facility used for athletic events, including, but not limited to, a gymnasium.

(d) For the purposes of this section, the term "recreational facilities" does not include any greenway, designated biking or walking path, an area that is customarily used as a walkway or bike path although not specifically designated for such use, open areas or fields where athletic events may occur unless the area qualifies as an "athletic field" pursuant to subdivision (1) of subsection (c) of this section, and any other area that is not specifically described in subsection (c) of this section.

(e) A person adversely affected by any ordinance, rule, or regulation promulgated or caused to be enforced by any unit of local government in violation of this section may bring an action for declaratory and injunctive relief and for actual damages arising from the violation. The court shall award the prevailing party in an action brought under this subsection reasonable attorneys' fees and court costs as authorized by law. (1995, c. 398, s. 1; 2011-268, s. 21(b); 2013-369, s. 6; 2015-195, s. 15.)
 
I read that statute three times. I am not a lawyer, and my eyesight is terrible.

It seems that the local municipalities cannot prohibit concealed carry that is otherwise “protected” by state law, unless it is a specifically identified “recreational facility”, i.e. athletic field, swimming pool, or gym, and any of their appurtenant structures, restrooms, locker rooms etc.

This does NOT include Greenways, designated bike paths, walkways, or areas used for such, open areas or fields where athletic events may occur unless area qualifies as an “athletic field” pursuant to blah, blah, blah...
 
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The state law referenced in the previous post does not specifically mention children's playgrounds. It does mention open areas and fields being exempt from local ordinances unless the open area qualifies as an athletic field and other areas not specifically described. Since children's playgrounds are not described am I right in thinking that a concealed carry permit holder can carry at such a facility? Common sense would indicate that a lawful concealed carry permit holder could do a lot of good protecting the children who are playing there if something unfortunate were about to happen.
 
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NC Farmer said:
The state law referenced in the previous post does not specifically mention children's playgrounds. It does mention open areas and fields being exempt from local ordinances unless the open area qualifies as an athletic field and other areas not specifically described. Since children's playgrounds are not described am I right in thinking that a concealed carry permit holder can carry at such a facility? Common sense would indicate that a lawful concealed carry permit holder could do a lot of good protecting the children who are playing there if something unfortunate were about to happen.
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I have seen the same signage as you at playgrounds, and treat it as a sign that was erected previous to the statute posted above, that is only a few years old.

ETA: The lack of clarity, or any reference whatsoever regarding playgrounds in the statute may be why we still see those signs.

I am not a lawyer, but if it ain’t in the statute, it ain’t in the statute. Meaning, just because it’s not mentioned, doesn’t mean it might be illegal.
 
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Some folks just need to know, especially noobs to concealed carry, that the penalties range from basically a traffic ticket, to a felony, depending on where you were carrying.

Risk/Reward trade-off, and all that.
 
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Seems pretty clear to me. Paraphrased:

1) An athletic field during an organized athletic event if the field had been scheduled for use with the municipality or county office responsible for operation of the park or recreational area.

(2) A swimming pool

(3) A facility used for athletic events, including, but not limited to, a gymnasium.

Children’s playgrounds are none of those things. Further:

(d) For the purposes of this section, the term "recreational facilities" does not include any greenway, designated biking or walking path, an area that is customarily used as a walkway or bike path although not specifically designated for such use, open areas or fields where athletic events may occur unless the area qualifies as an "athletic field" pursuant to subdivision (1) of subsection (c) of this section, and any other area that is not specifically described in subsection (c) of this section.

So, playgrounds are specifically excluded.

Carry on. So to speak.
 
JimP42 said:
Seems pretty clear to me. Paraphrased:

1) An athletic field during an organized athletic event if the field had been scheduled for use with the municipality or county office responsible for operation of the park or recreational area.

(2) A swimming pool

(3) A facility used for athletic events, including, but not limited to, a gymnasium.

Children’s playgrounds are none of those things. Further:

(d) For the purposes of this section, the term "recreational facilities" does not include any greenway, designated biking or walking path, an area that is customarily used as a walkway or bike path although not specifically designated for such use, open areas or fields where athletic events may occur unless the area qualifies as an "athletic field" pursuant to subdivision (1) of subsection (c) of this section, and any other area that is not specifically described in subsection (c) of this section.

So, playgrounds are specifically excluded.

Carry on. So to speak.
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This makes me feel really good, because I have always considered you to be way smarter and well read than me, and that’s what I posted. :D
 
fieldgrade said:
This makes me feel really good, because I have always considered you to be way smarter and well read than me, and that’s what I posted. :D
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Yep. Pretty much. I missed your second post after the long code quote and just went back to find it.
 
Correct, that playgrounds are G2G for CCW.

As I remember the laws that @fieldgrade posted where to address one sticking point. The in-use of the facility of the CCW.

I.E. A CCW who carried to the pool, then had to stow the firearm away, perform alethic activates (Swimming)

The question was, how is the firearm secured so a minor does to get access?

I think that's the original intent of the law, was to avoid that situation.
 
From the News And Observer, 10/25/2013: "The General Assembly passed a law in 2011 allowing people with permits to carry concealed firearms in public parks statewide, though it allowed cities to keep bans at recreational facilities such as playgrounds and athletic fields. This year, the legislature changed the law again, requiring cities to allow guns on playgrounds starting Oct. 1."

Ultimately, the City of Raleigh changed the signs, some with new signs and others by putting tape over the weapons line. (But I've since seen that some signs have had the tape pulled off, can't say whether it was by residents or the City). And for you Cary-haters, Cary had new signs up in every park the week before the law took effect and didn't try to fight it.

It takes time to unwind over a century of gun control, and you don't get everything you want the first time around. The R's first pro-gun bill after taking control in 2011 was tempered by a few RINO holdouts and a Democrat governor. As the R's majority grew, they were able to push through stronger bills. Since 2016, Roy Cooper has been a formidable obstacle. We've gotten several good bills through the Legislature since, including Constitutional Carry two years ago, but Cooper has vetoed every one of them. It wasn't until this year that the R's had the votes to override and repeal the PPP.

Edit to add: All of this was done through GRNC. I'm just a member and occasional volunteer but those of you still wasting your money on NRA dues would do well to redirect it to GRNC.

https://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/community/midtown-raleigh-news/article10281806.html
 
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