FCC Cites Baofeng Importer for Illegally Marketing Unauthorized RF Devices

Discussion in 'Communications' started by htperry, Aug 2, 2018.

  1. htperry

    htperry © 1957-20xx

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    08/02/2018

    The FCC has issued a Citation and Order (Citation) to Amcrest Industries, LLC (formerly Foscam Digital Technologies, LLC), an importer and marketer of popular and inexpensive Baofeng hand-held transceivers, alleging that the company violated FCC rules and the Communications Act by illegally marketing unauthorized RF devices. The FCC asserts that Amcrest marketed Baofeng model UV-5R-series FM hand-held radios capable of transmitting on “restricted frequencies.” The Baofeng models UV-5R and UV-5R V2+ were granted an FCC equipment authorization in 2012 to operate under Part 90 Private Land Mobile Radio Service (Land Mobile) rules.


    Read more - http://www.arrl.org/news/fcc-cites-baofeng-importer-for-illegally-marketing-unauthorized-rf-devices
     
  2. noway2

    noway2 Senior Member Charter Life Member

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    This came upon the 145.210 today, people were saying they discovered that Baofeng radios would xmit out of band and this is exacerbating the problem.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2018
  3. Pink_Vapor

    Pink_Vapor Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    Does that mean you can get a cheap, powerful handheld ham/maritime/cop radio?
     
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  4. noway2

    noway2 Senior Member Charter Life Member

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    Most of the cop and other public stuff has moved to Viper. The other stuff, you can receive without issue, but if you get caught transmitting the fines are immense.

    One way to think about it. You interfere with aviation traffic and the lives you endanger could include your own.
     
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  5. Pink_Vapor

    Pink_Vapor Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    Makes sense
     
  6. htperry

    htperry © 1957-20xx

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    It's about Baofeng importing radios that violate the law. Chinese consider cheating a sport; further that all is fair in business as long as you don't get caught. This is not a new or unknown case - I am glad we're finally enforcing our own laws. If we're not going to enforce laws, then remove them from codification.
     
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  7. Alpha007

    Alpha007 Member

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    My question, although not about Baofeng exactly, is are there any American manufacturers of Amateur radios?
    Other than do it yourself I mean.
    Everything I have looked at is either Japanese or Chinese.
    Pardon me for high jacking this thread. But I gots to know!
     
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  8. Button Pusher

    Button Pusher Well-Known Member Benefactor

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    These radios are 'wide open', that is you can transmit all over the spectrum.
    Most ham radios are factory programmed to block transmit if it is out of band.
    These cheap imports are not. Yes I have one I keep at my night job.
     
  9. noway2

    noway2 Senior Member Charter Life Member

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    Yes Elecraft. Very good equipment. Excellent support and service, but pricey.

    A local ham at field day accidentally tuned to a band that someone else was transmitting on and his receiver (sensitive by design) took the full power blast that burned some circuitry. He posted on their forum and within a few hours the company president contacted him and said to send it back and they’ll fix it for free.
     
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  10. JohnFreeman

    JohnFreeman The bane of my existence Benefactor Charter Life Member Supporting Member

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    And occasionally tentec.....
     
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  11. noway2

    noway2 Senior Member Charter Life Member

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    Spectral purity hardware is where a lot the money is in the hardware. Good oscillators and filters using precision components. If you’re doing it all in software, you still need good converters and filters as well as expensive programming. There is a reason they’re cheap.

    On top of that do think the Chinese are going to give a rat’s hat about interference or our regulations?
     
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  12. Ikarus1

    Ikarus1 Avtomat Krishna-kov

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    This is a nothing burger. The main reason they're complaining is they don't meet the part 90 spec which is commercial radio and GMRS, and the primary importer (not the mfg) marketed them as such.

    I have other radios, not from Baofeng or this importer, that will recieve and transmit all over the spectrum. Guess who's responsible? The OPERATOR

    More statist garbage with monetary gain being the primary goal. Baofeng is almost single-handedly responsible for the growing re-kindling in amateur radio. Quickly let's slap their hands for something
    fairly minor in the big picture.
     
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  13. noway2

    noway2 Senior Member Charter Life Member

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    I absolutely agree with you on this, 100%. The responsibility is on the operator. It shouldn't be incumbent upon the manufacturer to nanny what frequencies the radio will transmit on.

    Similarly, I don't get the nonsense about using a radio on a band other then what it was initially marketed for. Again, the responsibility lies with the operator. I could build a radio and use it, the responsibility lies with me. I see no difference.

    Now, spectral purity, is something that the manufacturer has a responsibility oto handle properly. It should remain within the proper signal bandwidth, be properly modulated, and avoid excessive harmonic content.
     
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  14. Ikarus1

    Ikarus1 Avtomat Krishna-kov

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  15. htperry

    htperry © 1957-20xx

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    As a licensed amateur radio operator, you can build and operate in your licensed bands as part of the experimental hobby; something unique to regulated airwaves.

    It's not true that you can home build a radio and operate it on any FCC regulated airwaves as long as you are responsible. Radio equipment, even commercially made ham gear, under the law, must be "Type Accepted" and approved for use on certain bands and adhere to other regulations. Reception is much less regulated, but still must meet FCC guidelines on the receiver circuitry if it uses any type of signal generator, like a local oscillator.

    BTW, even CB radio equipment is Type Accepted, must meet certain regulations and isn't approved for out of band use, regardless of your license status. If a ham uses CB radio, they are still restricted to Part 95 regulations (Amateur Radio is Part 97). The catch is that a ham radio operator can re-purpose (considered experimental) any radio of any band for use in their licensed ham bands, as long as they adhere to the regulations of their license.
     
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  16. Ikarus1

    Ikarus1 Avtomat Krishna-kov

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    My baofeng didnt hear about the notice yesterday. Talked with my 13 year old on his FRS radio with my GMRS license on my non part 95 Baofeng. It was also tuned to a murs frequency.We were on a National wildlife refuge. Should i be concerned? [​IMG]
     
  17. htperry

    htperry © 1957-20xx

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  18. Long_Hunter

    Long_Hunter Embrace the Suck Benefactor Charter Life Member

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    Here is a reminder on an upcoming rule change by the FCC: On September 30, 2019, it will become illegal to sell or “offer for sale” (advertise) radios like the popular Baofeng UV-5R that can operate in the FRS radio band (462.5625 – 462.7250 MHz) and any other licensed band in a single device. Manufacturers will have to either quit selling them or block out the FRS bands–like they already do for the current cellular bands. This is the relevant verbiage:

    § 95.591 Sales of FRS combination radios prohibited.
    Effective September 30, 2019, no person shall sell or offer for sale hand-held portable radio equipment capable of operating under this subpart (FRS) and under any other licensed or licensed-by-rule radio services in this chapter (devices may be authorized under this subpart with part 15 unlicensed equipment authorizations).


    IF your going to get any extra to squirrel away, get them now. By law, these may still be bought by any adult. But a license is needed to operate them outside of the no-license FRS, GMRS, and MURS bands. (That is, in the amateur operators’ bands.)

    Note that this upcoming ban WILL NOT be a ban on the possession or use of FRS dual band ham radios. Nor will be it be illegal to gift them to other adults. Hence, any that are legally owned on or before September 30th will effectively become “grandfathered”. Read between the lines folks: The FCC doesn’t want non-licensed individuals to own radios that can transmit in both licensed bands and unlicensed bands. My supposition is that this is because in the long term they don’t want unlicensed folks to have plausible deniability for toting around ham band-capable gear.
     
  19. noway2

    noway2 Senior Member Charter Life Member

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    As a ham radio operator, one who has even taken the 4th license test and become a VE, I fully understand and appreciate the importance of not causing radio interference. As much as I am anti regulation, anti government, this is one of those few areas where some sort of agreement and plan is required. While not as applicable to the frequencies that these Baofengs operate, the interference can even cause problems internationally. It really doesn’t take much signal power to shut down someone’s communication.

    That being said, I still object to having some government agency try to declare these things “illegal” and tote out their favorite play thing: a ban. It is up to the operator, not the manufacturer to do the right (or wrong) thing. I object to the nanny state and this whole commercial radio used outside of the bands for which it was sold is stupid.

    I could make my own radio and be perfectly “legal” and the responsibility lies with me, the operator.

    @Long_Hunter sorry, but I don’t get the plausible deniability part, would you please elaborate as I am curious as to what you meant.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2019
  20. Long_Hunter

    Long_Hunter Embrace the Suck Benefactor Charter Life Member

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    Might be wrong choice of words, but gets after the ability to lock down wireless comms of all types and the ability of average joe to at a minimum listen in...its about accountability and the gov or rather unaccountable to the gov...Eventually I believe the end state will be freemen will unable to even purchase ham capable equipment without FCC licensure.
     
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  21. Goofyfoot2001

    Goofyfoot2001 Member Supporting Member

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    Got mine about 5 years ago I think
     
  22. Brian K

    Brian K Resident Douchenozzle Charter Member Supporting Member

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    All they'll do is block out that freq range and leave a big obvious resistor on the board that, when clipped or removed, opens that band back up.
     
  23. Long_Hunter

    Long_Hunter Embrace the Suck Benefactor Charter Life Member

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    Another box of Baofeng goodness going into storage....

    7EA1768A-E821-409B-B42C-B616994A670E.jpeg
     
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  24. Pink_Vapor

    Pink_Vapor Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    What model(s) did you go with?
     
  25. Long_Hunter

    Long_Hunter Embrace the Suck Benefactor Charter Life Member

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    These are all uv5r’s
     
  26. Pink_Vapor

    Pink_Vapor Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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  27. Pink_Vapor

    Pink_Vapor Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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  28. Long_Hunter

    Long_Hunter Embrace the Suck Benefactor Charter Life Member

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  29. Long_Hunter

    Long_Hunter Embrace the Suck Benefactor Charter Life Member

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    Pink_Vapor likes this.
  30. REELDOC

    REELDOC Member Benefactor Supporting Member

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    been reading about this in Survival Blog. Damn confusing on the best deal.
     
  31. JimP42

    JimP42 Mostly harmless Benefactor Charter Life Member

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    Are the currently available ones blocked on the FRS/GMRS frequencies?
     
  32. Long_Hunter

    Long_Hunter Embrace the Suck Benefactor Charter Life Member

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    The ones I have are not blocked.
     
  33. Pink_Vapor

    Pink_Vapor Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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  34. noway2

    noway2 Senior Member Charter Life Member

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    Sorry, but they're already there. Anytime I hear that damnable noise, I immediately hit the mute button and want to find a way to block the signal from my TV. I don't care about a stupid govt. alert.
     
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  35. Ikarus1

    Ikarus1 Avtomat Krishna-kov

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    Oh it's on every smartphone device now as well
     
  36. noway2

    noway2 Senior Member Charter Life Member

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    I know, dammit. I've currently got them all turned off except the one you can't, and I've considered flashing the device with that Linux based OS, Lineage I believe it's called. Except for the risk of making it into. $1,000 brick that I can't afford to replace, I would.
     
  37. REELDOC

    REELDOC Member Benefactor Supporting Member

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  38. Pink_Vapor

    Pink_Vapor Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    It doesn't look like a programming cable's included.
     
  39. Pink_Vapor

    Pink_Vapor Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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  40. bigfelipe

    bigfelipe I go my own way... Charter Life Member

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    So come next month it's illegal to sell your radio if it falls under this?