Federal Ordnance M14

Discussion in 'Appraisals - What's this worth?' started by GeorgeBush, Mar 2, 2018.

  1. GeorgeBush

    GeorgeBush Member

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    I know nothing about this gun except it's late 80's production and immaculate.

    I bet its only been to the range once, cleaned and stored.

    The only M14 clones I know anything about are the modern M1A weapons so this one is a bit of a mystery to me. If anyone can shed some light on it besides what I've read on Wikipedia I'd appreciate it.

    ...and a value too of course! Thanks,
     
  2. thrillhill

    thrillhill Super Moderator Staff Member Charter Life Member Sponsor

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    Got a friend who has one of these as well. He left if with me for quite a while when he was building a new house. I enjoyed shooting it, killed a couple of deer with it just for the fun of it. But unfortunately, I know next to nothing about them either.
     
  3. rdinatal

    rdinatal Better late then never...

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  4. GeorgeBush

    GeorgeBush Member

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    I don't have it handy... this is the same family member with the Garand I also have posted. I can likely get some SOON but I would suggest it looks like a stock photo in terms of condition (a non-abused blue and wood M14).

    If you need specific numbers though let me know where to find them!
     
  5. rdinatal

    rdinatal Better late then never...

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    I know there's different grades but I'll let someone with more knowledge reply about that. I just want to drool!! :(
     
  6. jmgdfther

    jmgdfther Member

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    I have one as well. You need to know the serial number because after a certain number they only used Chinese parts. I have attached an article below which gives a little more detail about the company.

    As far as value, again that depends on the serial number. If you have USGI parts I saw one sell for $1400 in 2013, Chinese parts are going to decrease the price.

    Background information on Federal Ordnance, Inc. from M14 Rifle History and Development Third Edition by Lee Emerson copyright 2006:

    "A. R. Sales Co., National Ordnance, Inc. and Federal Ordnance, Inc.

    Bob Brenner restarted Federal Ordnance about 1979. Jack Karnes went to work for Bob Brenner when Federal Ordnance was revived. He was employed by Federal Ordnance until 1984. Mr. Karnes then did consulting work for the company until 1985 or 1986. In early 1982, Federal Ordnance had plans to produce M1 Garand Rifles using newly manufactured receivers. Federal Ordnance was located at 1443 Potrero Avenue South El Monte, CA 91733. It sold military surplus firearms. In the late 1980s at least, Federal Ordnance, Inc. supplied a list of firearms manufacturers and importers addresses with its factory literature and a note encouraging customers to contact the manufacturer or importer to get an owner’s manual. Federal Ordnance also sold lightweight alloy M1911 style pistol frames marketed under its name and a trade name as well as selling a Springfield Armory, Inc. high-end M1911 style pistol.

    Federal Ordnance began production of its M14 type rifles by 1984 and ended around 1992. About 1992 Federal Ordnance, Inc. changed its name to Bricklee then shut down shortly thereafter. The business was revived twice more under different names before finally withering on the vine. According to a very reliable source, Federal Ordnance used the same Spanish company as National Ordnance, at least initially, to supply the raw receiver castings. Karl Maunz supplied some receiver castings in 1987 to Federal Ordnance. Federal Ordnance receivers machined while Jack Karnes was on board were of good quality.

    The Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price for a Federal Ordnance M14SA in 1988 was $629.00. The rifles were sold with a one year parts and labor warranty. Each Federal Ordnance M14 type rifle sold was accompanied by a factory inspection tag, warranty registration card, a copy of U. S. Army FM 23-8 and a fourteen page booklet on firearms safety and care. The safety booklet was written by Federal Ordnance, Inc. in 1984. The factory inspection tag included the following information about each rifle: date, stock number, a description, caliber, and signature fields for checking of headspace, test firing and inspection. The stock number for the fiberglass stock M14 was GU-0715. USGI M14 accessories such as magazines, magazine pouches, slings and cleaning kits were available from Federal Ordnance.

    Federal Ordnance built two types of M14 rifles, one with USGI parts and one with Chinese parts. USGI parts were used extensively in Federal Ordnance rifles through at least S/N 8877. Through at least serial number 394X the USGI parts were taken off USGI M14 rifles imported from Israel. By serial number 9844, if not earlier, Chinese and Taiwanese reproduction parts were used to assemble its rifles. For example, Federal Ordnance M14SA serial number 502XX was assembled at the factory on September 13, 1991 with Chinese manufacture bolt, operating rod, firing mechanism and barrel. Receivers with serial numbers above 60XXX have engraved heel markings. Federal Ordnance receivers observed are marked on the side with the letter F inside a circle. This marking is sometimes lightly stamped. Federal Ordnance sold complete rifles as well as stripped receivers.

    Synthetic stocks on Federal Ordnance M14 rifles may not have been USGI models but of unknown commercial manufacture. The original owner of Federal Ordnance M14SA serial number 22XX reports that the synthetic stock never had a selector cutout or USGI markings inside the magazine well. Further, the Federal Ordnance stock had a slightly rough finish. The butt plate was glossy black color instead of phosphate coated.

    Century Arms International assembled some of these Federal Ordnance receivers with Chinese parts at their facilities in Montreal, Quebec, Canada in 1990 just before the imported parts ban of November 29, 1990, brought them into the United States with the military style features (twenty round magazine, bayonet lug, flash suppressor, and hinged butt plate) which was legal at the time and sold them to the commercial market. Century Arms International ceased operations in Montreal around 1993.

    The Federal Ordnance marking may be located on the right receiver leg instead of the receiver heel for Century Arms International assembled rifles. Some Federal Ordnance M14SA receivers have serial numbers with the letter C prefix followed by a hyphen then four digits, e.g., C-0116. These letter C prefix serial number receivers were sold as stripped receivers to Century Arms International in 1990 for assembly into complete rifles. Century Arms International assembled very few M14 type rifles with Federal Ordnance receivers and Chinese parts, as compared to the number of Chinese rifles it later sold. Serial number C-0581 is the highest serial number for this series observed to date.

    As an aside, Jack Karnes manufactured some 81 mm mortar round fin assemblies in 2002 for the Paramount Studios movie We Were Soldiers. These rugged fin assemblies were made to withstand the pressure generated by the mortar ignition charges which were designed to create 18 " flames out of the mortar tube. His son was one of the armorers assigned to the movie production unit."
     

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  7. GeorgeBush

    GeorgeBush Member

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    Looked at it today... low 9100's. Main thing I noticed was it had a GI bolt but I suppose it probably has a few import/repo internals.

    Thanks for the info; what do you think about worth?
     
  8. cubrock

    cubrock Swell guy Benefactor Charter Life Member

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    With what we know, probably $900ish tops. If all GI parts and the parts all spec out in excellent to like new condition (particularly muzzle wear, throat erosion, and the dimensions of the op rod and gas piston), then I could see it bringing $1300-$1400 to the right guy. That right guy might buy it just to get the GI parts for a custom build. However, you would probably have to put it online to get that kind of money. M14-style rifles don't sell well around here unless they are cheap, especially if they aren't one of the big name makers.

    Don't know where you are, but if you are anywhere near Hickory, you can bring it by here (or to a gun show where I'll be) and I'll take a look at it for you. I have some gages for measuring parts wear.
     

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