HVAC

[amnesia]

Notice today that our AC was really struggling. We have two Hvac condensers outside and I noticed one isn’t running.

Both thermostats are turned on & pumping air but it’s doesn’t seem to help the inside temp.

Will air still blow through the ducts when one of these condensers are turned off? Am I thinking correctly that one is for upstairs and one is for downstairs? Or is it one is for heat and one is for AC?

Something tells me I need to replace a capacitor and more refrigeration added as the air that’s blowing isn’t that cold.

 

[Stick]

Notice today that our AC was really struggling. We have two Hvac condensers outside and I noticed one isn’t running.

Both thermostats are turned on & pumping air but it’s doesn’t seem to help the inside temp.

Will air still blow through the ducts when one of these condensers are turned off? Am I thinking correctly that one is for upstairs and one is for downstairs? Or is it one is for heat and one is for AC?

Something tells me I need to replace a capacitor and more refrigeration added as the air that’s blowing isn’t that cold.

The blowers will run just fine with the condensers out, so what you are seeing makes sense. What you have is two split systems that both heat and cool. It is likely to be a bad capacitor or a blown fuse on the condenser that quit running, they seem to like to go out at the start of cooling season. If the other condenser is running but still not cooling you have a bigger problem. How old are the units, and what kind of refrigerant are they running on? Also, do the condensers have the old cigar fuses in the disconnects or a circuit breaker at the panel?

 

[amnesia]

The blowers will run just fine with the condensers out, so what you are seeing makes sense. What you have is two split systems that both heat and cool. It is likely to be a bad capacitor or a blown fuse on the condenser that quit running, they seem to like to go out at the start of cooling season. If the other condenser is running but still not cooling you have a bigger problem. How old are the units, and what kind of refrigerant are they running on? Also, do the condensers have the old cigar fuses in the disconnects or a circuit breaker at the panel?

Ok that’s what was throwing me for a loop. The inside air was blowing but downstairs it feels like our fan was on and not hvac. I checked the thermo and it’s indeed set to cool.

The upstairs is ice cold but I suspect that’s also the one that has the condenser running. The units are older (14 years)but has new parts in the last 4 years. The units say r22 refrigerant but since work & maintenance has been performed I’d assume r14 or something newer has been used. When we purchased the place a year ago the hvac was inspected by an hvac tech which checked out good.

No cigar fuses at the panel. Let me check the disconnect.

 

[Cowboy]

Ok that’s what was throwing me for a loop. The inside air was blowing but downstairs it feels like our fan was on and not hvac. I checked the thermo and it’s indeed set to cool.

The upstairs is ice cold but I suspect that’s also the one that has the condenser running. The units are older (14 years)but has new parts in the last 4 years. The units say r22 refrigerant but since work & maintenance has been performed I’d assume r14 or something newer has been used. When we purchased the place a year ago the hvac was inspected by an hvac tech which checked out good.

No cigar fuses at the panel. Let me check the disconnect.

Is the unit not running lines iced up? Your correct in one will be an upstairs unit and one downstairs.

 

[amnesia]

Ok that’s what was throwing me for a loop. The inside air was blowing but downstairs it feels like our fan was on and not hvac. I checked the thermo and it’s indeed set to cool.

The upstairs is ice cold but I suspect that’s also the one that has the condenser running. The units are older (14 years)but has new parts in the last 4 years. The units say r22 refrigerant but since work & maintenance has been performed I’d assume r14 or something newer has been used. When we purchased the place a year ago the hvac was inspected by an hvac tech which checked out good.

No cigar fuses at the panel. Let me check the disconnect.

Ok there’s no disconnect on the side of the house or near the condensers like my last place. There used to be a sub panel that ran outside electric for the 50amp/30 amp and HVAC. When I got the whole house generator they moved the hvac to the main panel box.

After it’s raining I’ll walk outside to check behind the condenser panel & turn off the inside breaker.

 

[amnesia]

Is the unit not running lines iced up? Your correct in one will be an upstairs unit and one downstairs.

No ice. The condenser doesn’t even have a hum like it doesn’t have power. Leaning towards capacitor. Here’s the model number.

 

[Cowboy]

Hopefully that's all it is man.

 

[Burt Gummer]

@jjwestbrook

 

[jjwestbrook]

check at the inside unit and make sure the pan isn't full of water . could be the float switch or if you have a condensate pump it has a built in float switch which breaks low voltage power to outdoor unit if it quits pumping

 

[amnesia]

I checked the float drain. The pan in our hvac seems sealed with tape but the two overflow drains are coming out of it. No water backup but the one does have grime in it that looks like calcium and rust. It doesn’t seem to be a clogged drain but it can stand to be cleaned.

 

[jjwestbrook]

Next think would be to confirm volatage at outdoor unit. Unit needs both high voltage (230v) and control volatge (24v) from the thermostat in order to run if you have a meter and feel confident checking. Other wise its time for a pro. Where are you located ?

 

[amnesia]

Next think would be to confirm volatage at outdoor unit. Unit needs both high voltage (230v) and control volatge (24v) from the thermostat in order to run if you have a meter and feel confident checking. Other wise its time for a pro. Where are you located ?

I have a meter and should be confident to check the voltage from what I watched. I’m also not above calling a pro.

 

[jjwestbrook]

Give me a shout tomorrow and I'll walk you through checking the basics


8033255690

 

[Stick]

OK, good thing is the 2nd floor system is working. From the first post it sounded like they were both out. Let jjwestbrook talk you through checking power to the unit, if that's not it, yeah, call a pro.

Ok there’s no disconnect on the side of the house or near the condensers like my last place. There used to be a sub panel that ran outside electric for the 50amp/30 amp and HVAC. When I got the whole house generator they moved the hvac to the main panel box.

Now this could be a problem. There should be a disconnect within sight of the condenser, or a lockout on the circuit breaker in the main panel so the guy working on your condenser can make sure he doesn't get fried. I don't get why they would have moved the breaker when the generator panel was installed unless you got a big enough generator to run the A/C. You might have a job for an electrician here. Heck, if it just needs a lockout the HVAC contractor can probably do that for you.

 

[amnesia]

OK, good thing is the 2nd floor system is working. From the first post it sounded like they were both out. Let jjwestbrook talk you through checking power to the unit, if that's not it, yeah, call a pro.



Now this could be a problem. There should be a disconnect within sight of the condenser, or a lockout on the circuit breaker in the main panel so the guy working on your condenser can make sure he doesn't get fried. I don't get why they would have moved the breaker when the generator panel was installed unless you got a big enough generator to run the A/C. You might have a job for an electrician here. Heck, if it just needs a lockout the HVAC contractor can probably do that for you.

The generator will run both ACs as well. That’s why they moved it inside. Ended up getting a 22KW the price difference was $500 More vs the 18KW that only runs part of the house and would cost me more in labor to relocate breakers. I think the outside panel made it where they didn’t need outside disconnects because it was 10 ft from the condensers.

 

[BlackGun]

The generator will run both ACs as well. That’s why they moved it inside. Ended up getting a 22KW the price difference was $500 More vs the 18KW that only runs part of the house and would cost me more in labor to relocate breakers. I think the outside panel made it where they didn’t need outside disconnects because it was 10 ft from the condensers.

You really need that power disconnect outside by the unit. When they took out the outside panel you violated the code. If anyone services the unit and gets hurt you and the electrician are liable even when the next person owns the house. Call the generator electrician and explain the oversight they made. They will most likely want it correct. I’m sure the county inspector also just missed it. Disconnect should be within 50 feet, visible from appliance, lockable, no more than 6’7” high from center pull of disconnect means, and accessible. I added that in case you skipped the permit and need to do it yourself.

 

[Stick]

You really need that power disconnect outside by the unit. When they took out the outside panel you violated the code. If anyone services the unit and gets hurt you and the electrician are liable even when the next person owns the house. Call the generator electrician and explain the oversight they made. They will most likely want it correct. I’m sure the county inspector also just missed it. Disconnect should be within 50 feet, visible from appliance, lockable, no more than 6’7” high from center pull of disconnect means, and accessible. I added that in case you skipped the permit and need to do it yourself.

Correct. And a correction to my previous post, the provision for a lockout on the circuit breaker does not apply to residential installations. Yeah, I had to look this up.
From the 2011 NEC. I'm pretty sure nothing has changed:
440.14 Location. Disconnecting means shall be located within sight from and readily accessible from the air- conditioning or refrigerating equipment. The disconnecting means shall be permitted to be installed on or within the air-conditioning or refrigerating equipment.

The disconnecting means shall not be located on panels that are designed to allow access to the air-conditioning or refrigeration equipment or to obscure the equipment name- plate(s).

Exception No. 1: Where the disconnecting means provided in accordance with 430.102(A) is capable of being locked in the open position, and the refrigerating or air-conditioning equipment is essential to an industrial process in a facility with written safety procedures, and where the conditions of maintenance and supervision ensure that only qualified persons service the equipment, a disconnecting means within sight from the equipment shall not be required.

 

[amnesia]

You really need that power disconnect outside by the unit. When they took out the outside panel you violated the code. If anyone services the unit and gets hurt you and the electrician are liable even when the next person owns the house. Call the generator electrician and explain the oversight they made. They will most likely want it correct. I’m sure the county inspector also just missed it. Disconnect should be within 50 feet, visible from appliance, lockable, no more than 6’7” high from center pull of disconnect means, and accessible. I added that in case you skipped the permit and need to do it yourself.

Permit was pulled for all work so they both must have missed it.