Illegal Alien Gang Member cites 2A Rights, well its worked before

Let me first make it absolutely clear I am not in favor of limitless immigration or open borders. Far from it.

However, I would argue that the illegal immigrant did not violate any of our Rights by crossing an agreed-upon line on a map. He or she did not rob from your paycheck, or steal your job, take your food or your doctor’s appointment.

Now, the United States government - the one that’s there to supposedly protect the Rights of American Citizens in @Tarowah ‘s estimation, does in fact rob from your paycheck and then give the proceeds from that theft to various people, good and bad, those with legal status and those without.

The United States government - through domestic and foreign policies outside its Constitutional authority- does cause jobs to disappear here and be transferred overseas.

The United States government, through environmental policy that is outside its Constitutional authority - takes food that could be eaten and instead subsidized its use in fuel - with more money stolen from your paycheck.

The United States government decided what kind of health insurance you are allowed to have, in many cases how much it would cost - and either subsidize others to get it with money the government robbed from you - or mandate your premiums higher to cover the spread.

In short - the migrant, illegal or otherwise, is not the culpable party when it comes to all the entitlement spending that they receive. The government, bureaucrats and politicians who created, sustain, and administer the programs are.

I think your anger, while justified, is misplaced.



That, sir, is American exceptionalism, and the very argument Jefferson made in 1826, on the 50th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence. That the principles laid down at America's birth, however flawed in execution, would be a rebuke to reappearing tyranny.

Yes, they broke the law. But five of the first ten Amendments to the Constitution - fully half of the Bill of Rights, deals specifically with safeguarding the Rights of those accused of breaking the law, insulating them from government abuse of power rather than exposing them to greater hazard from it.

It is my opinion this was done deliberately and on purpose, as justifying the willful violation of any person's Rights has always led to that same justification being levied against everyone's Rights.



So are you arguing that all men may be equal, with the same God-given Rights, but that unless mortal men write down and vote on the right words, it is moral and just for governments to infringe or violate those Rights based on Citizenship?

You might change your tune when an illegal starts using your SS#.
 
You might change your tune when an illegal starts using your SS#.

And I might not.

My fellow Americans commit more identity theft in these United States than illegal immigrants.

Ask me how I know....
 
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Illegal is illegal, not matter what it is.
True.

But, at one point in our history, it was illegal to teach a black person to read.

It is illegal to load 9 rounds into a detachable magazine in NY.

It is legal for Congressment to act & invest on insider knowledged gained through their "service" on regulatory committees.

It is legal for a surgeon to amputate healthy genital tissue if a patient demands it, though it is illegal for the same surgeon to amputate a healthy arm if the same patient demands it.

Laws are things of man; therefore they are flawed.

Blind acceptance of "law" and "legality" is not the wisest choice. Neither is anarchy. A big problem in human existence is the desire to find simple answers to everything, which is where this thread has gone (to an extent). Problem is, existence is complicated and there are grey areas. Each must decide where he stands on those issues, in those instances, while not (egregiously) infringing on the lives and rights of others.

Not an easy task.
 
Well I was going to open the can of worms and bring up the fact that not everyone believes in God, everyone doesn’t believe in the same God and at what point do you/we stop saying we have “God given rights”, the Christian God shares the popular belief now, but what about in 20,40 or 60 years when we have more “non Christian” people clamoring about their “God given rights” to allow them to do things we don’t agree with, it is a very slippery slope that works perfectly fine when the “majority” of the people agree with what or who “our” God is, but what happens when we no longer have that luxury?

Get your throwing arm ready folks, the stonings and honor killing commence at sundown........

But I won’t get into any of that since it would cause way too many heads to explode.
 
Well I was going to open the can of worms and bring up the fact that not everyone believes in God, everyone doesn’t believe in the same God and at what point do you/we stop saying we have “God given rights”, the Christian God shares the popular belief now, but what about in 20,40 or 60 years when we have more “non Christian” people clamoring about their “God given rights” to allow them to do things we don’t agree with, it is a very slippery slope that works perfectly fine when the “majority” of the people agree with what or who “our” God is, but what happens when we no longer have that luxury?

Get your throwing arm ready folks, the stonings and honor killing commence at sundown........

But I won’t get into any of that since it would cause way too many heads to explode.

You could make the argument God Given rights are natural rights. So they are inherent in you being a human being, regarless of your religion or lack there of. Read enough on natural rights and they make a lot of sense. I may not have anything in common with an ignorant pig of a socialist from Paris, but I beleive that person has a natural right to certain things. Freedom of speech and self defense at the forefront.
 
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You could make the argument God Given rights are natural rights. So they are inherent in you being a human being, regarless of your religion or lack there of. Read enough on natural rights and they make a lot of sense. I may not have anything in common with an ignorant pig of a socialist from Paris, but I beleive that person has a natural right to certain things. Freedom of speech and self defense at the forefront.
Agreed. I can still think of a whole host of things that illegal aliens are coming here, getting, taking, and even stealing that are none of those natural rights but rather functions, services, and privileges that belong to the citizenry of the country.
 
The truth of it is all rights are granted/recognized by man. Luckily we have a Constitution that protects our rights somewhat vs having tribal wars every other week to reassert them. It is also lucky that we have provisions that limit how people can simply cross the border and claim the same rights we recognize for citizens.

I think god might have intervened one time on my behalf this life time and even then I am willing to chalk it up to luck. Mark Robinson has done more for my 2nd amendment rights than any deity.
 
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