J-frame twitch

[Red Marley]

Dadgum it, when I shoot my DAO J-frame Smiths, the barrel twitches to the right when the trigger breaks. I am a right-handed shooter and have small-ish hands; twitch happens one-handed or two-handed. It does not happen with my K-frames, Colt Diamondback or Ruger LCRx when I shoot them in double-action; they do not twitch. My groups are tolerable - it's not a huge twitch, but it is noticeable and consistent.

I've tried rotating my hand farther around the grip on the J-frames, and rotating is less far; I've tried different positions of my finger pad on the trigger. Tried gripping it tighter or looser, but I can't seem to eliminate the J-frame twitch. Does this happen to any of you, and have you found a way to cure it? I like my J-frames and don't want to part with them, but I want to shoot them better. It seems to be something to do with the revolver's geometry and mine.

 

[Catfish]

Sounds like a geomerty / poor fit thing. Have you tried changing the grips or using a Tyler T-grip insert?

 

[Red Marley]

Sounds like a geomerty / poor fit thing. Have you tried changing the grips or using a Tyler T-grip insert?

One J-frame has a Hogue rubber grip, and the other one has the stock birds-head wood grip. Both twitch the same. And I have a Hogue rubber grip on a K-frame which does not twitch. I do have a bad thumb joint on my right hand (trail bike/tree incident...) but it doesn't seem to affect anything. I've tried pulling to the right with my trigger finger and pushing to the left with it, but the J's still twitch to the right.

 

[Tim]

some guns fit, some don't.

I can't shoot a Glock without putting a hole in the ceiling, but I shoot my XD(m) like Wyatt Earp.

 

[Bailey Boat]

The J frames are one of the most difficult guns to shoot in double action. I've been shooting them going on 50 years and have tried almost every replacement grip on the market and the original Herret's (with a back strap filler) are far and away the best for me.
I think the issue with the little J frame is the back strap to trigger geometry. By it's nature it's short and rounded. Once the back strap filler is introduced the reach increases and the vertical grooving of the grips (on the front strap and the back strap) helps to stabilize the gun in the hand.
Another thing I have done to the J frames that I carry is to remove all grooving from the face of the trigger and smooth it out. This keeps the trigger finger from having anything to "grip" onto and cause the dreaded right side pull.
If you're anywhere close to me you're welcome to shoot one of mine and see if it's better before dropping coin on mods...

 

[CZfool68]

Sounds like it's time for a CZ thread!

 

[Red Marley]

The J frames are one of the most difficult guns to shoot in double action.

Thanks BB - at least now I know it's not just me. I'll have a look at the Herrets. On my LCRx, I found the Badger grips made a big difference.

 

[Bailey Boat]

Thanks BB - at least now I know it's not just me. I'll have a look at the Herrets. On my LCRx, I found the Badger grips made a big difference.

Your biggest issue will be finding a set of original Herret's. Most of what you'll see on line are knock off's, and not very good knock off's.... That's why I suggested you try some of my J frames before dropping coin...

 

[Red Marley]

Bit far to drive from Raleigh but I appreciate the kind offer. What style Herret grips did you end up with?

 

[Bailey Boat]

Bit far to drive from Raleigh but I appreciate the kind offer. What style Herret grips did you end up with?

I have a couple of styles that I like, Shooting Stars and the Shooting Aces..... I was buying from Herret's back when you sent in a tracing of your hand, and that was quite some time ago....

 

[Red Marley]

I came across this tip for shooting J-frames from Jerry Miculek - he suggests holding it like this, with the left thumb behind the right:

I tried it just now (dry firing) and the gun doesn't appear to twitch like it does with a more conventional grip. Before replacing any more stocks, I'm going to give this a try at the range. I think it will make a big difference, but it will take practice to make it SOP, because you'd never hold a semi-auto this way.

 

[Bailey Boat]

And there's no need to hold a J frame that way either. Bear in mind that JM is looking to dump as many rounds as possible with little regard to actual accuracy. His "accurate" is on an 18" x 24" plate at 15 (or less) feet where ours may be head shots with such a minor gun and caliber. In addition his right forefinger is digging into his left forefinger and he actually "staging" the trigger, not doing a clean sweep of the trigger arc.... Try whatever you think may work or we'll meet up one day and I'll show you how to shoot a J frame. PS: Free of charge....

 

[Ikarus1]

s a newly minted J-frame EDC guy, I highly recommend the Pachmayr Diamond Pros. They are shorter than the Hogue, but swell at the palm. I can shoot my 637-2 in DA mode pretty darn well at 20ft on 6" steel.

Here they are on a model 60



I like them so much I put them on my SP101 and it tames even the stoutest .357 loads

 

[Studentofthegun]

I came across this tip for shooting J-frames from Jerry Miculek - he suggests holding it like this, with the left thumb behind the right:

I tried it just now (dry firing) and the gun doesn't appear to twitch like it does with a more conventional grip. Before replacing any more stocks, I'm going to give this a try at the range. I think it will make a big difference, but it will take practice to make it SOP, because you'd never hold a semi-auto this way.

I'm also a revo shooter. But I'm no expert and don't claim to be one. But I have a theory about what is happening.

You might be tightening your grip while pulling the trigger. This is pronounced even more with a J frame because of the grip geometry (like Bailey said) and recoil anticipation. The reason the thumb over technique often works is because it is immobilizing your hand and gives you the perception that you've got a more stable grip....and you are therefore not gripping while you press the trigger. While I am a fan of Jerry, I personally do not recommend the thumb over grip. I'm more in favor of a consistent grip across all pistols and revolvers. Just my opinion though. Now, that may or may not be what is happening in your case but it's worth checking out.

One last thing: it may also help if you polish the trigger so that it is really slick. This is often done on competition revolvers. Your finger is supposed to slide a little bit on the trigger as you press it. Polishing seems to help. I've even done that to my little 642 that I carry.

Hope this helps.

 

[Studentofthegun]

Bear in mind that JM is looking to dump as many rounds as possible with little regard to actual accuracy. His "accurate" is on an 18" x 24" plate at 15 (or less) feet where ours may be head shots with such a minor gun and caliber.

I wouldn't say that is true. Yeah, an 18" x 24"....at 200 yards.

In addition his right forefinger is digging into his left forefinger and he actually "staging" the trigger, not doing a clean sweep of the trigger arc.... Try whatever you think may work or we'll meet up one day and I'll show you how to shoot a J frame. PS: Free of charge....

Jerry does not stage the trigger under the vast majority of circumstances. Here is proof in slow motion. Staging the trigger is outdated doctrine and has virtually no place in defensive shooting and is a crutch in competition. Calling it a crutch is probably being too kind. With sufficient practice one can learn to maintain sight alignment throughout the trigger press.



Shooting a small revolver like a J frame is very easy to do. But it is very hard to do it well.

 

[Bull Durham]

Sounds like a geomerty / poor fit thing. Have you tried changing the grips or using a Tyler T-grip insert?

+100 on this^^^!
The T grip made a Yuge difference on mine. Well worth the money.

 

[NKD]

Studentofthegun can shoot a J frame like a frigging boss!

Ive seen it myself on several occasions!
Challenging guns to shoot well.
I love shooting DA revos! Really gotta have it together to make good hits.

 

[Friday]

I highly recommend the Pachmayr Diamond Pros.

Seconded.
The Diamond Pros are my go-to with aftermarket rubbers. I've had them on several revo's and they've never come off.
I have a full size Judge with them, and it completely transformed the gun for the good.
Probably the biggest transformation was with this one-

Taurus 415T (titanium) ported 41 magnum. 21 ounces.
If there's a gun that wants to move on you it's this one. Solid as a rock with the Pachmayr's.
And they're cheap to try. If you don't like it you're out less than 30 bucks.