KSHB TV HIdden dangers at gun ranges- Lead Poisoning

Cue the CA requirement for copper bullets. All the benefits of an ammo tax without all the unpleasant side effects of angry taxpayers.
 
I was talking to the guy that helps run Pro-Shots up here in Winston. According to him all employees there get tested regularly for lead. They also use special lead removing detergents on their hands and surfaces. So while lead does exist in the environment there, it isn't really that big a deal unless you are shooting then licking your fingers, or licking the shooting tables on the firing line.

Which hey...liberals may do...they kinda look like windows...
 
I dont have good range hygiene but I get blood tested for lead every couple years. No lead. Somebody makes hand wipes that supposedly remove lead. I'm going to google that now and buy some for the back of the family truckster.
 
From my understanding, you're most likely to get exposed to lead dust at an indoor range. I think an outdoor range with open air ventilation probably has much lower exposure.

I shoot a lot of cast lead bullets, so I make a habit of washing my hands with dish detergent after every shooting session to get as much lead off my skin as possible.

My biggest fear for lead exposure is when I clean my brass. I use dry walnut to tumble my brass, and when I'm sifting the brass out of the media, it creates a lot of dust that I'm sure contains lead among other things. I've been considering picking up a 3M respirator to use when sorting and sifting brass just for an added layer of safety.
 
Most ranges around here offer deleading handsoap at their wash basins. I make sure to take advantage of that. Not sure how much it actually helps, but makes me feel better.

I had never thought about the risk of lead and other chemical exposure until I watched an employee sweep up the range in goggles, marshmello suit and a respirator. Makes sense if you're sweeping and cleaning the range every day to take that type of precaution.
 
RedneckFur said:
From my understanding, you're most likely to get exposed to lead dust at an indoor range. I think an outdoor range with open air ventilation probably has much lower exposure.

I shoot a lot of cast lead bullets, so I make a habit of washing my hands with dish detergent after every shooting session to get as much lead off my skin as possible.

My biggest fear for lead exposure is when I clean my brass. I use dry walnut to tumble my brass, and when I'm sifting the brass out of the media, it creates a lot of dust that I'm sure contains lead among other things. I've been considering picking up a 3M respirator to use when sorting and sifting brass just for an added layer of safety.
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I picked up a 3m respirator from Lowe’s last year when I started cerakoting and for the few extra bucks it was well worth having replaceable filters, I think I paid $35-$40 for it and if I can’t smell the cerakote while spraying it, it should be more than adequate for lead dust.
 
B00ger said:
So while lead does exist in the environment there, it isn't really that big a deal unless you are shooting then licking your fingers, or licking the shooting tables on the firing line.

Which hey...liberals may do...they kinda look like windows...
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HEY! Nothing wrong with licking windows! Especially when they taste like Copenhagen :p Only bad part is it's kinda hard to do with a helmet on.
 
ugafx4 said:
Most ranges around here offer deleading handsoap at their wash basins. I make sure to take advantage of that. Not sure how much it actually helps, but makes me feel better.

I had never thought about the risk of lead and other chemical exposure until I watched an employee sweep up the range in goggles, marshmello suit and a respirator. Makes sense if you're sweeping and cleaning the range every day to take that type of precaution.
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I was happy on my first day at Jim's to see the range manager in his white "suit" and booties and respirator....very stylish!
I'm sure I could do better at swabbing myself off before going home, though....I have the wipes in the bag.....
 
Booties are a solid idea at an indoor range. Take them off right before washing your hands so you don’t track stuff into your car and house.
 
Much ado about nothing. The levels of lead most people are exposed to are so insignificant that it represents no danger. Even if you're a shooter, on an indoor range if the levels were of consequence the great, almighty EPA would have shut it down a long time ago. Now, if you're a duck or a California Condor you still have protections with all of the non lead alternatives. Anyone know of anybody that died from lead exposure, NOT injection just normal exposure, name them......
 
B00ger said:
it isn't really that big a deal unless you are shooting then licking your fingers, or licking the shooting tables on the firing line.
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Who knew? I'll try to do better. :rolleyes:
 
And if you are of an age when the Dixon No 2 Lead Pencil was the thing to have in school, you are already screwed if it was going to be an issue. Remember all those kids that chewed their pencils in class ? Not to mention handling fishing sinkers, car wheel weights and dive weights, etc.
 
JFC it's a boogie man. IF your indoor range is hazy and you smell like gunpowder you might might have elevated lead level. If its almost cool and you can't light a match and the air is pulled from the firing line to the backstop you'll never have a problem.

Owned a indoor range, we tested everyone even clerks who were never on the range. Saved one person, he had old lead pipes in his house, bad bad water leach. When we closed our outdoor range, guess where the old berm and lead went? On the new range as berms. All federally approved.

Lead free ammo has a shorter shelf life. Already seeing duds in 7 year old ammo. You have to eat a ton of lead paint chips or inhale lead powder to really be poisoned. There are other first hand lessons I won't speak to now but know it is a anti gun ploy. Lead bullets in the berm now will be there a million years from now causing no harm.
 
Catfish said:
Poor ventilation is probably the biggest vector for lead to get into your body at a gun range. Other than being shot, of course.
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Yup. Inhalation. Ingested lead is seldom the culprit.
 
john galt said:
JFC it's a boogie man. IF your indoor range is hazy and you smell like gunpowder you might might have elevated lead level. If its almost cool and you can't light a match and the air is pulled from the firing line to the backstop you'll never have a problem.

Owned a indoor range, we tested everyone even clerks who were never on the range. Saved one person, he had old lead pipes in his house, bad bad water leach. When we closed our outdoor range, guess where the old berm and lead went? On the new range as berms. All federally approved.

Lead free ammo has a shorter shelf life. Already seeing duds in 7 year old ammo. You have to eat a ton of lead paint chips or inhale lead powder to really be poisoned. There are other first hand lessons I won't speak to now but know it is a anti gun ploy. Lead bullets in the berm now will be there a million years from now causing no harm.
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I used to work for an environmental consulting firm. One of our clients 20 years ago or more was a shooting range in western NC. Neighbors sued the range for elevated lead in their ground water. We tested the soil in the berm and compared it to the natural soil in the surrounding area, including the suing neighbor's land. The ambient soil lead concentrations were two orders of magnitude higher than the lead concentrations in the berm. The lead in their ground water was naturally occurring.

They were really upset about the noise (even though they moved in after the range) and went after the range the best way they were advised - environmental impact, though it proved to be NONE. They didn't have a leg to stand on after we did our thing, but it cost the range a lot of money.
 
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RedneckFur said:
From my understanding, you're most likely to get exposed to lead dust at an indoor range. I think an outdoor range with open air ventilation probably has much lower exposure.

I shoot a lot of cast lead bullets, so I make a habit of washing my hands with dish detergent after every shooting session to get as much lead off my skin as possible.

My biggest fear for lead exposure is when I clean my brass. I use dry walnut to tumble my brass, and when I'm sifting the brass out of the media, it creates a lot of dust that I'm sure contains lead among other things. I've been considering picking up a 3M respirator to use when sorting and sifting brass just for an added layer of safety.
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I cut up used dryer sheets and threw them in the tumbler. Cuts the dust way down. Dryer sheets come out black!

CD
 
ugafx4 said:
I had never thought about the risk of lead and other chemical exposure until I watched an employee sweep up the range in goggles, marshmello suit and a respirator. Makes sense if you're sweeping and cleaning the range every day to take that type of precaution.
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This was me, 6 days a week back in the late 90/early 2000's...sans protective gear.

Worked part time at a big indoor range.
When I tried to ETS from .mil, my ETS date was significantly delayed due to blood levels of lead much higher than allowed. I was put on horse pills that sucked the minerals from my body.
I was sapped of mojo for weeks.

Airborn lead is the issue.
 
Since we're on this topic let me ask about something related: Oxidized lead.

Are old oxidized white powdery cast bullets with no lube any more dangerous to handle than other ammo?
 
Catfish said:
Since we're on this topic let me ask about something related: Oxidized lead.

Are old oxidized white powdery cast bullets with no lube any more dangerous to handle than other ammo?
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Yes. Box any you have up and ship them to me for disposal immediately... I'm hazmat certified. Just make sure to put a label on the box for the postman's safety...


:D
 
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Catfish said:
Since we're on this topic let me ask about something related: Oxidized lead.

Are old oxidized white powdery cast bullets with no lube any more dangerous to handle than other ammo?
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Yes. The oxidized lead is far worse for you to breathe in than non oxidized. Shoot em or melt em outdoors.
 
jimmyjames8 said:
https://www.webmd.com/balance/guide/what-is-chelation-therapy
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Chelation works if properly done.If not it releases the metals in your body to be reabsorbed in a worster way. Works to remove other metals as well, mercury (got metal fillings), aluminum, etc.
For some treatments high amounts off egg whites or white bread should be eaten to help absorb and remove them.
Cilantro works and is believed by many to be even more powerful when it is combined with chlorella.
 
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jimmyjames8 said:
I dont have good range hygiene but I get blood tested for lead every couple years. No lead. Somebody makes hand wipes that supposedly remove lead. I'm going to google that now and buy some for the back of the family truckster.
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Me too. I shot on a poorly ventilated high school basement range every school day for two years, reloaded for 46 years and shot for 48 years and I have been tested for lead and barely budged the needle on lead in the body. Lead is a serious issue for sure but as long as common sense hygiene is followed, it isn't a problem as related to shooting.
 
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Ferrisfan said:
Booties are a solid idea at an indoor range. Take them off right before washing your hands so you don’t track stuff into your car and house.
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Well, he was wearing them after a cleaning, but not wearing them just around. I'm probably not going to wear them either. (I'm hoping my instruction will be moving outside very soon anyway, before it gets too hot for me to be out!)
 
We used to do IDPA practice at an indoor range where they would close off one of the isolated sides and allow us to have full access to the lanes all the way down to the back stops. Whenever I was there I kept thinking about the air flow and stuff I had to have been tracking on my shoes. When I got home, the first thing I did was shower.
 
Picher was a little town in extreme NE Oklahoma, maybe a few thousand people and was the boyhood home of Micky Mantle. They had shallow lead deposits, and it was mined heavily. Most of the bullets we fired in both world wars came from the Picher mines. The mines were so shallow that sinkholes were opening up and swallowing buildings and cars. Trucks over a certain weight couldn't drive in town.

The tailings were piled up high in little mountains all around town. Everything in Picher was extremely contaminated, including the water and even the dust in homes. Eventually the EPA bought the whole down, moved everyone out, and bulldozed everything. I went through there after everyone left but before it was bulldozed, and it looked like one of those "Life Without People" episodes on Discovery; a true ghost town.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picher,_Oklahoma
 
georgel said:
We used to do IDPA practice at an indoor range where they would close off one of the isolated sides and allow us to have full access to the lanes all the way down to the back stops. Whenever I was there I kept thinking about the air flow and stuff I had to have been tracking on my shoes. When I got home, the first thing I did was shower.
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I've gotten better about using the wipes in my bag on my arms and hands and face, and I shake out my sweater and scarf before I get in the car, and head right for the shower and the clothes washer once I get home....God knows what I'm tracking in! But I'm not going to stop shooting now!!!
 
There is a indoor range in Hickory that the fog of lead and smoke is so thick that it looks like a sci-fi movie scene. I hear the owner could never come back because of the lead dosing. There is very little light in the bays. I call it the dungeon. If you come with a light and laser on your weapon it’s pretty cool. It’s like it’s a real life war zone atmosphere.
 
BlackGun said:
There is a indoor range in Hickory that the fog of lead and smoke is so thick that it looks like a sci-fi movie scene. I hear the owner could never come back because of the lead dosing. There is very little light in the bays. I call it the dungeon. If you come with a light and laser on your weapon it’s pretty cool. It’s like it’s a real life war zone atmosphere.
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Might as well wear a respirator to get the whole post apocalyptic experience. :D
images
 
On the before mentioned high school range the rifle team coach had us boys dig the lead out of the sand below the angled steel deflector which the coach would then trade to a gun shop for .22 match ammo. No wonder my grades were so low in high school, all of the that lead handling stunted my brain cells!
 
rufrdr said:
On the before mentioned high school range the rifle team coach had us boys dig the lead out of the sand below the angled steel deflector which the coach would then trade to a gun shop for .22 match ammo. No wonder my grades were so low in high school, all of the that lead handling stunted my brain cells!
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Yeah, that's it. That's the reason. :rolleyes:
:D

Just think on this lead thing a little further, I remember having a flash suppressor on a rifle that would get a light shiny gray coloring along the vents. And I thought, is that the base of the lead bullets being vaporized and deposited on the flash suppressor? I was shooting jacketed, but open based bullets at the time. And it gave me something to think about. :eek:
 
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