lets be honest-Reloading for precising shooting - little long

KnotRight

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Lets be honest about reloading. Mainly rifle reloads:

Do you measure the max O.A.L. your load that will fit into your chamber via a magazine by the bullet?

1. Do you tumble all brass before reloading even if they are first time fired through your gun?
2. Do you trim all rifle cases after each shot? All calibers and action types.
3. Do you clean the primer pocket before priming?
4. Do you use range brass?
5. Do you fL resize all your brass?
6. Do you use the same lot of primer and powder?
6B. Do you use a balance or digital scale or both? How expensive is the digital scale?
7. Do you use a powder thrower?
8. Do you trickle the load to the exact weight?
9. How often do you check the weight of the bullets?
10. Are you using competition dies?
11. How often do you check the overall length of the reloaded rounds?
12. How often do you clean your dies?

13. Keep a log book of every round fired? if so, what data do you keep?

With all the steps above is just a couple parts of shooting LR. The next question is how much better is a $500 rifle vs a $700 rifle vs a $1,000 rifle. Then goes the to sighting/scope. Where do you start and stop based on price?

With all the best loads and equipment, will the average shooter benefit from answering and following the above questions with a yes? Where is the line drawn?
 
I mag check all my rounds.

1. I don't tumble new brass

2. no

3. yes

4. no

5. yes

6. yes

6b. RCBS chargemaster 1500, have a balance beam to check with

7. no

8. use to

9. I do not

10. no

11. I mag check all my ammo

12. after use

13. I use an impact data book
 
Do you measure the max O.A.L. your load that will fit into your chamber via a magazine by the bullet?

1. Do you tumble all brass before reloading even if they are first time fired through your gun?
- Yes
2. Do you trim all rifle cases after each shot? All calibers and action types.
- I measure all and trim as needed
3. Do you clean the primer pocket before priming?
- Yes
4. Do you use range brass?
- No
5. Do you fL resize all your brass?
- I neck size brass for bolt action rifles only
6. Do you use the same lot of primer and powder?
- Yes
6B. Do you use a balance or digital scale or both? How expensive is the digital scale?
- Both, you get what you pay for - generally
7. Do you use a powder thrower?
- Yes
8. Do you trickle the load to the exact weight?
- Yes
9. How often do you check the weight of the bullets?
- I weigh a representative sample
10. Are you using competition dies?
- Yes
11. How often do you check the overall length of the reloaded rounds?
- Every rifle round, representative samples for pistol rounds
12. How often do you clean your dies?
- Frequently (as needed)
13. Keep a log book of every round fired? if so, what data do you keep?
- I document performance results for all groups
With all the steps above is just a couple parts of shooting LR. The next question is how much better is a $500 rifle vs a $700 rifle vs a $1,000 rifle. Then goes the to sighting/scope. Where do you start and stop based on price?

With all the best loads and equipment, will the average shooter benefit from answering and following the above questions with a yes? Where is the line drawn?
- Some things that a competitive shooter does may be such a marginal benefit that I can't measure because of equipment or my skill level
 
$350 300 win mag with $50 scope and I do all those things except log book. I use a scrap o paper in the box. I can hit target well. Not a rac driver but a silver dollar would be toast.
 
Do you measure the max O.A.L. your load that will fit into your chamber via a magazine by the bullet?
Absolutely

1. Do you tumble all brass before reloading even if they are first time fired through your gun?
Yes

2. Do you trim all rifle cases after each shot? All calibers and action types.
No, just spot check batch being reloaded.

3. Do you clean the primer pocket before priming?
Yes

4. Do you use range brass?
NEVER for precision loads

5. Do you fL resize all your brass?
Not for precision bolts, neck only. For semi autos, yes.

6. Do you use the same lot of primer and powder?
Attempt to. Check and verify results when there's a change

6B. Do you use a balance or digital scale or both? How expensive is the digital scale?
Digital, but with a consistent technique using a trickler. Digital scale costs have fallen dramatically in the past 10 years but a good balance is worth having as a back up and to verify the digital.

7. Do you use a powder thrower?
Yes, but only to throw the bulk of the charge, trickler to bring up to weight.

8. Do you trickle the load to the exact weight?
Always for precision ammo.

9. How often do you check the weight of the bullets?
Spot check, but my precision bullets are all match to begin with. Bear in mind, there are other factors that affect bullet flight, especially as the bullet goes transsonic at distance. Meplat consistency is one and there are dies made to insure the meplats of fmj competition bullets are consistent.

10. Are you using competition dies?
Yes, but you haven't asked about presses. You will NOT reload quality precision ammo on a progressive, won't ever happen. Serious precision shooters/benchrest guys use a single stage or coax, often multiple presses, each with a die mounted that doesn't come out to insure max consistency.

11. How often do you check the overall length of the reloaded rounds?
Every 10 or so. Caveat- see previous comment about meplat consistency. An inconsistent meplat can yield false OAL meaning the ogive of the bullet distance to rifling is not consistent. That distance is critical to best accuracy.

12. How often do you clean your dies?
About every 1k or so. Cleaning is nothing more than a rinse with brake cleaner with no disassembly.

13. Keep a log book of every round fired? if so, what data do you keep?
No.

With all the steps above is just a couple parts of shooting LR. The next question is how much better is a $500 rifle vs a $700 rifle vs a $1,000 rifle. Then goes the to sighting/scope. Where do you start and stop based on price?
Depends. Price isn't everything as there is a point of diminishing returns. Also consider the rifle/optic is a system. A 1k rifle with a Barska crapola scope will never shoot to its full potential. Converse is also true, a clapped out Rem700 with a shot out bore won't hit anything with a Schmidt/Bender on it.

With all the best loads and equipment, will the average shooter benefit from answering and following the above questions with a yes? Where is the line drawn?
Define "average". Most "average" shooters I've seen would benefit far more from learning shooting fundamentals before delving down the equipment rabbit hole. A quality, off the shelf rifle like a Savage 10xxxxxx with a decent scope and decent factory ammo will be fairly accurate. To get the best out of the combo described, first learn to shoot, then learn precision reloading, then start looking at equipment. But to the initial point, quality ammo and equipment will always be a benefit IF the skill of the shooter is there to take advantage of it. In hotrodding we used to say, speed costs money, how fast do you really want to go? And to that I'd also add, the caveat- if you can drive worth a crap.
 
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Do you measure the max O.A.L. your load that will fit into your chamber via a magazine by the bullet?

I am limited by mag length (PMags are slightly longer than USGI mags 2.264 vs 2.26, so I load to 2.262” with long bullets (77gr TMK for example)

1. Do you tumble all brass before reloading even if they are first time fired through your gun?

Absolutely. I even treat my brass in Lemishine solution

2. Do you trim all rifle cases after each shot?
All calibers and action types.

No

3. Do you clean the primer pocket before priming?

I use a uniforming bit that spaces off the case head for a uniform depth that cleans the debris from the pocket

4. Do you use range brass?

I inspect it and only keep certain brass. Once fired LC, Hornady, Nosler etc

5. Do you fL resize all your brass? Yes. I use 223 small base and FL 308

6. Do you use the same lot of primer and powder?

No; impossible to do so over years of reloading

6B. Do you use a balance or digital scale or both? How expensive is the digital scale?

Digital; bought my RCBS Chargemaster on sale at Midway and it’s been going strong 7 years

7. Do you use a powder thrower? No

8. Do you trickle the load to the exact weight? No

9. How often do you check the weight of the bullets? New boxes; I check a handful randomly

10. Are you using competition dies? Yes, in 223 and 308 and I love the RCBS seating die bullet window

11. How often do you check the overall length of the reloaded rounds? I check the first five rounds and then every fifth round

12. How often do you clean your dies? Just whenever the thought occurs to me or the press seems “sticky” I will lube the handles and ram etc

13. Keep a log book of every round fired? if so, what data do you keep?

I keep track of what charges work and which don’t and I keep track of how many rounds I fire through each barrel

With all the steps above is just a couple parts of shooting LR. The next question is how much better is a $500 rifle vs a $700 rifle vs a $1,000 rifle. Then goes the to sighting/scope. Where do you start and stop based on price?

I don’t start and stop based on price; I figure out what I need and see what’s available

With all the best loads and equipment, will the average shooter benefit from answering and following the above questions with a yes? No

Where is the line drawn?
Gotta dive in and figure it out honestly
 
These are good questions- can you make your post a poll instead so it'll be easy to get a summary? (it's the option at the bottom of create a new post)
 
Lets be honest about reloading. Mainly rifle reloads:

Do you measure the max O.A.L. your load that will fit into your chamber via a magazine by the bullet?
YES
1. Do you tumble all brass before reloading even if they are first time fired through your gun?
YES
2. Do you trim all rifle cases after each shot? All calibers and action types.
YES
3. Do you clean the primer pocket before priming?
YES
4. Do you use range brass?
RARELY for match type rounds
5. Do you fL resize all your brass?
YES
6. Do you use the same lot of primer and powder?
TRY TO
6B. Do you use a balance or digital scale or both? How expensive is the digital scale?
BOTH
7. Do you use a powder thrower?
NO
8. Do you trickle the load to the exact weight?
DOES THAT ON THE DIGITAL, YES FOR THE BALANCE
9. How often do you check the weight of the bullets?
EACH BOX WHEN OPENED, random sample
10. Are you using competition dies?
YES
11. How often do you check the overall length of the reloaded rounds?
ALWAYS
12. How often do you clean your dies?
WHEN NEEDED
13. Keep a log book of every round fired? if so, what data do you keep?
YES, date, temp, wind, sun or cloudy, all load specs, group shot with each load, chrono data when I chrono, rounds on the barrel, COAL, ogive length, primer, powder, brass and number of firings, etc.
With all the steps above is just a couple parts of shooting LR. The next question is how much better is a $500 rifle vs a $700 rifle vs a $1,000 rifle. Then goes the to sighting/scope. Where do you start and stop based on price?
You don't know until you shoot them, a blind hawg will find an ancorn and I've found many cheap rifles that will shoot when loaded properly. Have had cheap scopes perform with expensive scopes, luck of the draw.
With all the best loads and equipment, will the average shooter benefit from answering and following the above questions with a yes?
I believe that when you take away as much mechanical issues away as you can then it is up to the trigger puller.
Where is the line drawn?
There is no line to draw. No line necessary.................
 
1. Do you tumble all brass before reloading even if they are first time fired through your gun?
YES

2. Do you trim all rifle cases after each shot? All calibers and action types.
NO, I spot check the lot and only trim when they are beginning to grow and then only as they approach maximum or if the variation begins to increase case to case. This has not been as much a problem since I started annealing after each firing.

3. Do you clean the primer pocket before priming?
YES

4. Do you use range brass?
NO, I want to know where my precision brass has been.

5. Do you fL resize all your brass?
Only for semi-autos, bolt guns I only full length resize when they start to get tight in the chamber, otherwise I bump the shoulder back 2 thou and call it good.

6. Do you use the same lot of primer and powder?
YES, I typically buy by the primers by the case and powder in 8 lb quantities. I chronograph the loads when I change and adjust data .

6B. Do you use a balance or digital scale or both? How expensive is the digital scale?
DIGITAL, GemPro 250

7. Do you use a powder thrower?
YES, throw 2-5 tenths light, then trickle up.

8. Do you trickle the load to the exact weight?
YES, to the point of removing and resetting the pan at kernel increments to hit just at the target weight.

9. How often do you check the weight of the bullets?
I will typically weigh 12 bullets and compare the average, and STDEV to previous lots.

10. Are you using competition dies?
YES, Redding

11. How often do you check the overall length of the reloaded rounds?
I worry less about overall length, and prefer to measure Length to Ogive as that keeps my bullet jump the same. I measure every round until I am convinced that everything is settled down and consistent, then every 10th round.

12. How often do you clean your dies?
I clean them in Acetone after every loading session primarily because I use both lanolin/alcohol lubricant and graphite for the case necks and they tend to build up in the dies if I do not.

13. Keep a log book of every round fired? if so, what data do you keep?
I do when not running a ladder test or shooting with friends that are new to shooting.
 
0. Do you measure the max O.A.L. your load that will fit into your chamber via a magazine by the bullet?
Not by OAL. Ogive and distance to lands. Mags mean nothing.

1. Do you tumble all brass before reloading even if they are first time fired through your gun?
Yes. Clean brass shoots better, riiiiight?

2. Do you trim all rifle cases after each shot? All calibers and action types.
Not all. Bolt, precision, yes, every time, check, trim of needed.

3. Do you clean the primer pocket before priming?
No. Welcome to stainless tumbling.

4. Do you use range brass?
Rarely for precision. Always for plinking.

5. Do you FL resize all your brass?
Yes.

6. Do you use the same lot of primer and powder?
Powder, Yes. In most cases. If I have to split a batch between lots, I'd rather mix / combine both lots and use as one batch.
Primers, always the same lot for that batch of reloads.

6B. Do you use a balance or digital scale or both? How expensive is the digital scale?
Both. Redding Beam and Pact digital. $250ish bucks for the electronic. I've got a Hornady digital as well.

7. Do you use a powder thrower?
Not for precision loads.

8. Do you trickle the load to the exact weight?
Yes, electronic powder scale / dispenser.

9. How often do you check the weight of the bullets?
I check a handful from each lot. Match bullets are pretty close. Larger variances which effect accuracy are in brass volume, so I will weigh, sort, and separate cartridge volume and load specific to that before bullet weight.

10. Are you using competition dies?
Yes. Redding and RCBS.

11. How often do you check the overall length of the reloaded rounds?
Never OAL. Ogive, always. Every round until dimensions stop wandering. Then random as I think of it.

12. How often do you clean your dies?
Typically when they show signs of being dirty. Sometimes 500ish rounds?

13. Keep a log book of every round fired? if so, what data do you keep?
Yes. My personal load "serial number" caliber, powder, primer, pill, brass, respective lot numbers, date, number of time brass has been shot, applicable dimensions to cartridge, dimensions for specific rifle, crono data if it was a workup load, or expected MV if it's a known / tested load, environmental data, range data, etc.

And I'd like to say.... In my defense your Honor, she looked single.
 
Do you measure the max O.A.L. your load that will fit into your chamber via a magazine by the bullet?
No (Bullet comparator and ogive gauge) I do not use magazine

1. Do you tumble all brass before reloading even if they are first time fired through your gun?
Yes
2. Do you trim all rifle cases after each shot? All calibers and action types.
Yes
3. Do you clean the primer pocket before priming?
When Needed
4. Do you use range brass?
No
5. Do you fL resize all your brass?
Yes
6. Do you use the same lot of primer and powder?
Yes
6B. Do you use a balance or digital scale or both? How expensive is the digital scale?
Both balance scape is the main though.
7. Do you Yuse a powder thrower?
No
8. Do you trickle the load to the exact weight?
Yes
9. How often do you check the weight of the bullets?
Check all before I start loading
10. Are you using competition dies?
No. Just normal Redding dies
11. How often do you check the overall length of the reloaded rounds?
Just first round to make sure it will chamber correctly
12. How often do you clean your dies?
When needed.
13. Keep a log book of every round fired? if so, what data do you keep?
I try. POI, Groups, Weather, Load info

With all the steps above is just a couple parts of shooting LR. The next question is how much better is a $500 rifle vs a $700 rifle vs a $1,000 rifle. Then goes the to sighting/scope. Where do you start and stop based on price?
I buy what I can afford. It does not bother me if someone has something better. I am not one to try to "keep up with the Jones'"

With all the best loads and equipment, will the average shooter benefit from answering and following the above questions with a yes? Where is the line drawn?
For me the line is when I stop having fun trying to improve my shooting
 
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Do you measure the max O.A.L. your load that will fit into your chamber via a magazine by the bullet?
Only for mag fed rifles. For bolt guns I care about the cartridge base to ogive measurement
1. Do you tumble all brass before reloading even if they are first time fired through your gun?
Yeah
2. Do you trim all rifle cases after each shot? All calibers and action types.
Measure them all. Trim when needed.
3. Do you clean the primer pocket before priming?
Yeah
4. Do you use range brass?
Not for precision, just blasting.
5. Do you fL resize all your brass?
Yes, but set up to not oversize.
6. Do you use the same lot of primer and powder?
Yes
6B. Do you use a balance or digital scale or both? How expensive is the digital scale?
Digital, Gempro 150
7. Do you use a powder thrower?
Only for ball powder
8. Do you trickle the load to the exact weight?
Yes
9. How often do you check the weight of the bullets?
Rarely
10. Are you using competition dies?
Yes
11. How often do you check the overall length of the reloaded rounds?
Once, after the dies are set up it doesn’t change. Adjust for throat wear as necessary, but that is a whole nother can of worms.
12. How often do you clean your dies?
Probably yearly, or when there dirty.
13. Keep a log book of every round fired? if so, what data do you keep?
Not that particular. I know how many rounds each rifle has by the number of bullets I’ve bought/have left. I do keep data on zeroes, sight adjustments, and the the real dope on actual drops,etc.
 
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