Re-setting my AR....

[Bailey Boat]

I currently have my reflex sight riding on top of the receiver (no BUIS because I can't see them with my eyesight) my light/laser is 45 degrees on the left and my QD sling attachment is on the bottom of the rail. The problem is that this configuration only allows the laser to be zeroed at one range.

If I move the sling attachment to the 45 degree position and the light/laser to the bottom will the sling introduce any "torque" to the forearm that would affect the gun?? My forearm is a Midwest Slim Line model and free floats. It is only attached to the the gun at the receiver.

The question is, am I creating an issue or would this be okay?? With all of that said, you guys have forgotten more about the AR platform than I'll probably ever know so I bow to your expertise and advise......

 

[Catfish]

Might make it ride a little wonky while you and Lucy are walking down to your bench but I can't see it affecting shooting unless it makes the sling uncomfortable for you somehow.

 

[CZfool68]

Ditch the sling, get a much brighter light and use the sling swivel to mount to a 50 lb Atlas bipod. Then place weapon up in your tower so you can have a 360 degree view of all feral cats, cyclists and neighborhood kids. Then party on Sir.

 

[Ikarus1]

if it's freefloated, there should be no way you can torque it with a sling by hand. That'd be the entire reason for a freefloat tube. Well and bipod use.

 

[Tim]

if it's freefloated, there should be no way you can torque it with a sling by hand. That'd be the entire reason for a freefloat tube. Well and bipod use.

I'm gonna go ahead and disagree with you here. A free float eliminates contact with the barrel and subsequent change in the harmonics. A sling can certainly introduce torque on the rifle as a whole if not employed properly and this torque can certainly effect the user's marksmanship. It ( a sling) doesn't change the rifle's inherent accuracy, but does impact the real world effectiveness.

 

[Ikarus1]

I'm gonna go ahead and disagree with you here. A free float eliminates contact with the barrel and subsequent change in the harmonics. A sling can certainly introduce torque on the rifle as a whole if not employed properly and this torque can certainly effect the user's marksmanship. It ( a sling) doesn't change the rifle's inherent accuracy, but does impact the real world effectiveness.

Not much more than layng the rifle in a rest. The point of introducing any type of barrel harmonic is an order of magnitude less with a FF handguard than one with an A2 sight and sling....otherwise whats the point of it?

Its basic physics.
The barrel nut area is much stiffer than the point forward of the gas block on just about every AR barrel made. And about 8-12 inches closer to the chamber, minimum.

 

[Tim]

Not much more than layng the rifle in a rest. The point of introducing any type of barrel harmonic is an order of magnitude less with a FF handguard than one with an A2 sight and sling....otherwise whats the point of it?

Its basic physics.
The barrel nut area is much stiffer than the point forward of the gas block on just about every AR barrel made. And about 8-12 inches closer to the chamber, minimum.

A rest, a bipod, etc. are all static; they aren't imparting any force on the system at all. The rifle 'rests' on a rest. A sling, on the other hand, employs a dynamic force - a push or a pull - that can affect the marksmanship result. Think of it this way, if you're getting ready to shoot and I grab your handguard to give it a big spin, you're probably gonna miss.

Now, a sling can absolutely enhance marksmanship when properly employed - the force of the shooter pulling that slung rifle tight into a shoulder offsets the wobbly nature of an unsupported rifle. But, improperly emplyed, the sling can cause marksmanship issues. Very much the same way an improper grip on your pistol does.

 

[Ikarus1]

A rest, a bipod, etc. are all static; they aren't imparting any force on the system at all. The rifle 'rests' on a rest. A sling, on the other hand, employs a dynamic force - a push or a pull - that can affect the marksmanship result. Thikn of it this way, if you're getting ready to shoot and I walk grab your handguard and give it a big spin, you're probably gonna miss.

Now, a sling can absolutely enhance marksmanship when properly employed - the force of the shooter pulling that slung rifle tight into a shoulder offsets the wobbly nature of an unsupported rifle. But, improperly emplyed, the sling can cause marksmanship issues. Very much the same way an improper grip on your pistol does.

Ok. You should shoot skeet with Baileyboat and give him some marksmanship lessons. I promise it wont be the gun that embarrasses you

 

[Tim]

Ok. You should shoot skeet with Baileyboat and give him some marksmanship lessons. I promise it wont be the gun that embarrasses you

If we were talking about shotgunning, he'd smoke me for sure. By Bailey's own admission he's not an AR nut. I'm fairly confident in my rifle skills, thanks. But I'm not sure why you went there. Bailey specifically asked about a sling mount and how it would impact things,

You said above, "it's basic physics", and yet you don't seem to grasp the fact that a sling has it's own impact on the 'basic physics' of the rifle. I'll let it go at that.

 

[Ikarus1]

If we were talking about shotgunning, he'd smoke me for sure. By Bailey's own admission he's not an AR nut. I'm fairly confident in my rifle skills, thanks. But I'm not sure why you went there. Bailey specifically asked about a sling mount and how it would impact things,

You said above, "it's basic physics", and yet you don't seem to grasp the fact that a sling has it's own impact on the 'basic physics' of the rifle. I'll let it go at that.

Much much less impact on a FF tube. Barrel harmonics. Not marksmenship or POA involved. You're gonna zero the rifle hopefully as you would shoot it.. That's exactly why people freefloat guns. The end.

 

[RR]

Bill,

How tall is your light/laser?

Depending on the answer to that question, you may be able to mount it at 12 o clock and have your reflex sight picture completely clear it. If it's too tall would you consider a more compact package there?

As to the torque question. I have all my AR slings with the rear mount either at the receiver end plate via QD or threaded through the stock and the front mount is a QD at 9 o clock. I haven't had an issue using them that way.

 

[Combat Diver]

I currently have my reflex sight riding on top of the receiver (no BUIS because I can't see them with my eyesight) my light/laser is 45 degrees on the left and my QD sling attachment is on the bottom of the rail. The problem is that this configuration only allows the laser to be zeroed at one range.

If I move the sling attachment to the 45 degree position and the light/laser to the bottom will the sling introduce any "torque" to the forearm that would affect the gun?? My forearm is a Midwest Slim Line model and free floats. It is only attached to the the gun at the receiver.

The question is, am I creating an issue or would this be okay?? With all of that said, you guys have forgotten more about the AR platform than I'll probably ever know so I bow to your expertise and advise......

Not knowing how above the line of sight of your Reflex sight is but can you mount the light/laser on the 12 o'clock rail? Your sight should be able to over look the light/laser. I also run my lights at the 3 o'clock on the right side and sling mount is on the left side at 9 o'clock. This way the rifle hangs down with the muzzle down putting to the left. Right hand stays on the PG and stock is at shoulder. Something like this M4A1 setup.


CD

 

[Bailey Boat]

The reflex sight is 1.75" to the point of the reticle and the light is 2.175" from the rail to the very top. I really like both pieces of gear and wouldn't want to change either. I tried sitting the light on top at 12:00 but it blocks the reflex sight.

I need to more or less keep my HD/BO setups close to the same for the sake of training LJ on the operation of both weapons. The Tac 14 was easy because of the limited range having the laser/light offset isn't an issue, but the AR presents different dynamics and different problems. The light on both weapons are the same, Streamlight TLR 2 HL G....

The only time I see using the sling would be for carrying but wondered what the effect would be if I did decide to use as a stabilizing force when shooting and it exerting a "sideways" pull on the forearm.

 

[BigWaylon]

Setting this up for HD? How far are you planning on shooting? Dial the laser in at 100 yards. That's going to put all the holes in a small group at any distance up to that point, and for a decent distance past that.

Just because it's at 45-degrees, instead of at 3/6/9/12, it's still the same variance at different distances. ~2" off at 0 & 200 yards.

 

[Zbizzle911]

If I were going to run a laser it'd be one like @Combat Diver suggested. That way it and you sight are on the same position as the sight. Also I do believe that you can induce torque on the rail and change the POI for both the barrel and the laser.

 

[Tailhunter]

HD
Why sling it at all?

Yes, anything attached to the forearm can induce torque.
Attach the sling if you must at the butt stock and then again closest to the reciever. Less torque can be exerted where everything is the stiffest.

Anything that effects barrel harmonics, effects poi.

I once had a Geissele gas block that was inducing flyers by contacting the barrel during the shot. Drove me crazy trying to find the problem.

 

[Bailey Boat]

Setting this up for HD? How far are you planning on shooting? Dial the laser in at 100 yards. That's going to put all the holes in a small group at any distance up to that point, and for a decent distance past that.

Just because it's at 45-degrees, instead of at 3/6/9/12, it's still the same variance at different distances. ~2" off at 0 & 200 yards.

More haul butt with a rifle, I have my Little Friend the Tac 14 for up close welcome parties.
I have thought about this and I believe I'll leave the light/laser on the bottom, zero at 50, see what it does at 100 and call it a day. All I'm really after is minute of man not precision, besides I'm still shooting the original Bushmaster barrel (whatever it may be) and have no idea of what it is capable of.
Thanks for all the replies and advise.....