Road is mush

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after last night's rain, about 50' of my road has turned into thick muddy silty mush. My daughter got stuck badly enough I needed a tow - couldn't get it out with the tractor without breaking anything. I got stuck twice too.

It's somewhat better today & I have tried to move the surface mush off the road. Just wondering what suggestions everyone has for a more permanent fix to this? (It's not really a drainage problem, more of a firmness problem). I have some ideas already, curious what others have found to work.
 
Just adding rock to it this time of year is not usually good enough if base under it has problems as the rock will just go down in mud and you wasted money but sometimes required just to get you to dryer weather. Really not a great time of the year for road work if you can help it or catch a long dry spell. Geo fabric under one helps but thats not a quick easy fix. If you can keep water out of it or flowing to ditches is best.
 
Dig out the mush a couple feet, use geotextile fabric and put ABC stone back and roll it in to pack in about 4” lifts. If it’s that wet now it’s just gonna get worse. If the road isn’t crowned enough to shed water a scrape blade will help. Pics would really help us give you better advice.
 
I had a similar issue when I lived in KY. This might sound odd but after I got it drug the way I wanted with what we called Crush&Run I spread about 20 bags of Portland Cement across the length of it. I rolled it a few times with a roller behind my 8N. Some light rain helped it to set up nicely. I moved a couple years later so that's all I know. Good luck!
 
Crusher run has a lot of dust that packs extremely well.
Winter months are the hardest on a drive way.

Sometimes if a tree was pushed out of the way to make the drive, where the root ball was can present a problem.

Scrape it the best you can. Build the base with CR and cover with 57’s after your base is satisfactory.

My drive was 1450 feet and with a simple scrape blade I could keep it looking great.

5C7D0FC0-850C-47B2-B5E2-8A419F4F5A32.jpeg
 
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The worst spot is near, but not directly over, a recently installed pipe. I dragged 2-3 bucketfuls of sludge off, so that spot is a bit flatter than it was - I could probably try to crown it a bit more.

It held up pretty good with the heavy rains a couple weeks ago, with the sludge being stopped by the drainage dams - this one was heavy enough to get things wet but not heavy enough to really drain into the ditch.

I suspect a good bit of this is the loose pack from filling over the pipe.
 

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That’s good Packable dirt also, when it’s not wet. If those depressions get full of water it’ll take forever to dry up. Doesn’t look in very bad shape. Just could use some drier material on it.
 
That’s good Packable dirt also, when it’s not wet. If those depressions get full of water it’ll take forever to dry up. Doesn’t look in very bad shape. Just could use some drier material on it.
If you're referring to the sides of the road, those go all the way down the hill to the creek. I try to keep it from getting any real low points since it's been graded and the ditches & rock put in. This is really the only spot with a problem anymore, so I'm trying to figure out the next step to firm it up.

Suggestions so far back up what I've been thinking, so I guess that's good.
 
The dirt looks like excellent topsoil but not for a road. That will take a lot of crush and run to firm it up. That’s not a low cost fix in my opinion. I’d love to have it to seed my yard.
 
You are right - you need a firm base. Dirt won't cut it. You have to keep packing rock into the muddy spots until they aren't muddy spots any longer. To start with, the whole thing is probably a muddy spot, but it will improve as you keep at it.
 
Today's misty rain has messed it up again:
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Here's the drainage ditch
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Wider view
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This is the only way in or out from my property. Right now I am stuck - the only vehicle we have that can pass this is the tractor.

The mud is sticky, texture is like soft clay.

You guys have given some good suggestions for long term fixes, but right now I'm looking for something short term, so we can get out of here this weekend! I have more rip-rap and a couple tons of 57, you think I can do anything with that? I was thinking maybe just using some to build it up as suggested, even if it may wash away - should get me through the immediate need. Thoughts?
 
While trying to sort out a solution, I’d park my car at the road and either walk or use to tractor to get back and forth.
 
While trying to sort out a solution, I’d park my car at the road and either walk or use to tractor to get back and forth.
Bit late for that, can't get the car TO the road :(

Also, that spot is half a mile from the house. It's also half a mile to the highway, but the road is solid about 15 yards beyond that.

The worst area where everything is stickign is only about 5-10 yards. Might look like more, but it's all right where the road was dug for the drainage pipe.

Obviously, I'm getting the guy who did that work to do a permanent fix, but I'm also looking for more info & ideas in the meantime.
 
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The 57 will just mash into the ground and after the first hard rain it will be lost. You can put the rip rap down and try to level it out with the 57 over it.
 
Can you pull the car “to safety” with the tractor and leave it there?
 
57 isnt worth much...but I'm sure the buick isnt as heavy as a tri-axle with 17 tons of gravel..but still, #57 will sink if there is no stable base under it
 

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Would not be cheap & not sure how flat they would lay with the crown, but something to get you thru the wet winter months could be wooden mats like used in the log woods for log truck roads over wet spots. You can get them that just cover wheel tracks or the larger ones that covers the whole road... wide enough for a log truck to drive on. But they would have to lay flat because of the ground clearance on you cars ... not as much a issue on pickup trucks or higher ground clearance.
 
Plank road using buried 4x4's or something similar? You need to spread out the tire load. You're way out west... Any surplus Marston matting? Pretty sure its origin is western NC
 
A bunch of old pallets would probably do it except for the nails. Old RR ties or landscape timbers.

You might be able to get a load or two of rip rap delivered today or not the worst part. If it is only where they dug for the pipe, that should do enough to get through.
 
The more you stir it up in this weather the more water it will take on and get worse and take longer to dry out that clay. If it were mine I would back blade it with bucket lightly enough to leave slick on top if you can to prevent it holding water in ruts and then next week when weather is better and drys off lightly work it if needed and pack it back really well to shed water with a crown and lightly cover it with the stone you have as a temp fix for traction. But the more you stir it with it raining on it the worse it will get. Its mostly likely a result of the unsettled dirt where the pipe was put in and till it tightens back up and drys out not a lot you can do unless you bridge it somehow with geo cloth or wooden mats.
 
Can you pull the car “to safety” with the tractor and leave it there?

I can't get that car in the pic out, already spent quite some time trying. Not enough room to get another one past it - I would just end up with a car in each ditch.

Would not be cheap & not sure how flat they would lay with the crown, but something to get you thru the wet winter months could be wooden mats like used in the log woods for log truck roads over wet spots. You can get them that just cover wheel tracks or the larger ones that covers the whole road... wide enough for a log truck to drive on. But they would have to lay flat because of the ground clearance on you cars ... not as much a issue on pickup trucks or higher ground clearance.

hmm, that's a thought.

Plank road using buried 4x4's or something similar? You need to spread out the tire load. You're way out west... Any surplus Marston matting? Pretty sure its origin is western NC

I'm just outside Raleigh, to the east. Any suggestions on that?

A bunch of old pallets would probably do it except for the nails. Old RR ties or landscape timbers.

You might be able to get a load or two of rip rap delivered today or not the worst part. If it is only where they dug for the pipe, that should do enough to get through.

I was thinking something like that. I have maybe half ton to a ton of rip rap to start with. So far seems to be the consensus.

The more you stir it up in this weather the more water it will take on and get worse and take longer to dry out that clay. If it were mine I would back blade it with bucket lightly enough to leave slick on top if you can to prevent it holding water in ruts and then next week when weather is better and drys off lightly work it if needed and pack it back really well to shed water with a crown and lightly cover it with the stone you have as a temp fix for traction. But the more you stir it with it raining on it the worse it will get. Its mostly likely a result of the unsettled dirt where the pipe was put in and till it tightens back up and drys out not a lot you can do unless you bridge it somehow with geo cloth or wooden mats.

Sadly, I'm not left with much option, since unless I do something about it, I'm stuck until it dries, and then stuck again next rain. As it is, my son has had to notify work that he won't be able to make it today, and probably tomorrow. No option to bridge it as suggested because I can't get out to pick up any of that. Maybe I can find someone I know in the area to help with that some time tomorrow...

At least we keep a good food stock at home.
 
I think I may be able to get a truck of rock by tomorrow, more like railroad ballast than 57. Hopefully a truckload will be enough.
 
Railroad ballast is what I came here to type. That'll get you through the short term but it won't last. Ballast in the mud and 57 stone over that would be a nice surface for a little while.
 
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I think I may be able to get a truck of rock by tomorrow, more like railroad ballast than 57. Hopefully a truckload will be enough.


It should be a good start being larger than the 57 stone and not be as large or as hard on car tires as the rip rap. The rip rap would need to be bedded down in the road bed some how for a car to clear it or not pinch a tire sidewall.
 
ok so it seems like what I'm getting:

Short term:
  • ballast first
  • 57 over that to smooth it
Long term:
  • build up a base with rip rap
  • ballast on top of that
  • gravel to smooth the top
Seem about right?
 
Long term I'd advise you to remove and replace or amend the unsuitable soil. You might be dismayed at how much rock and money you can throw into a hole trying to turn bad dirt into a road base. And if you have to fix this problem every year....
 
I would see how the ballast does with 57 over the top threw the winter if it tightens back up you may not need the rip rap once it has settled back if you do still need something I would go with the geo fabric under it instead of rip rap as it is probably cheaper and still save more rock in the long run. Unless you have heavy traffic the fabric only needs installing about 4-6” under gravel.
 
Thank you, everyone, for the input.

I wasn't able to get ballast yesterday, but I got enough gravel (bigger than 57 - #5 I think he said?) to firm up the surface for the short term. Where I go from here will depend a lot on the weather, but I think I have some good plans how to proceed for a permanent fix.

Turns out it's more like 25 yards that are mushy - noticed that while spreading the rock today.

As for weather - Farmer's Almanac says "mild wet winter". They usually get things pretty decent but it seems they're a bit off on the "mild" part already, so here's hoping the rest is wrong too :)
 
My driveway is about .3 miles and has been in place for 25 years. It still takes 2 tandem truck loads of 57 every couple of years to keep it in shape. Some folks in China have very solid basements by now.
 
Whoa.........i imagine your driveway is an adventure after a good rain...... Forget owing a car.....you need a swamp buggy!
 
Whoa.........i imagine your driveway is an adventure after a good rain...... Forget owing a car.....you need a swamp buggy!

It can get... interesting.

Last year, with all the water, it never dried out enough to work. Those drainage ditches you see now? Imagine those meandering down the middle, and cutting across at various points.

This is about the best it's been since I moved here. And I have a full mile of fun to get to pavement!
 
Wow........ where did you find enough land in Franklin Co. to have a mile long driveway? Last time I was down there everything looked like a suburb of Raleigh or was planted in nursery.
 
Crusher run has a lot of dust that packs extremely well.
Winter months are the hardest on a drive way.

Sometimes if a tree was pushed out of the way to make the drive, where the root ball was can present a problem.

Scrape it the best you can. Build the base with CR and cover with 57’s after your base is satisfactory.

My drive was 1450 feet and with a simple scrape blade I could keep it looking great.

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you taking that hunk o junk tractor to Tx? ;)
 
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