Single stage press recommendations

I will explain what I know with my die set... Redding Competition. It comes with 3 dies....Body, Neck Bushing, and a Seater die.

Body Sizing die - This sizes everything on the case except for the neck. This is needed when the shoulder needs to be pushed back. With light loads from a bolt rifle you may not use this die very often. With a semi auto, you will probably use this every time. When its tough to fully chamber the round (close the bolt) its probably time to for a Full Length or Body Die. (Given the fact you know your rounds aren't too long and the rifle is fairly clean.)

Neck Sizing Die - Sizes the neck only......this is where the bushings come into play. Bushing are inserted to size neck to desired diameter.....thus setting neck tension. With a bolt action rifle this is all that may be needed for a few firings. This helps your brass last longer by not using a body or full length sizing die (these dies work the brass harder). Many people also feel that neck sizing may make your ammo more consistent since it has been fire formed to your chamber.

Seating Die - I think you got this.


Not with the Competition set but.....
Full Length Sizing dies - neck tension not adjustable unless it uses bushings. For FL Sizing dies that use bushings.....the only real advantage I can see here is if you had a round that needed full length sizing frequently (such as a semi-auto or a hot magnum round), it will save you a step in the reloading process - instead of using a body and neck die to achieve a Full Length sizing, you just have to use the one die.
 
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BowWow said:
I will explain what I know with my die set... Redding Competition. It comes with 3 dies....Body, Neck Bushing, and a Seater die.

Body Sizing die - This sizes everything on the case except for the neck. This is needed when the shoulder needs to be pushed back. With light loads from a bolt rifle you may not use this die very often. With a semi auto, you will probably use this every time. When its tough to fully chamber the round (close the bolt) its probably time to for a Full Length or Body Die. (Given the fact you know your rounds aren't too long and the rifle is fairly clean.)

Neck Sizing Die - Sizes the neck only......this is where the bushings come into play. Bushing are inserted to size neck to desired diameter.....thus setting neck tension. With a bolt action rifle this is all that may be needed for a few firings. This helps your brass last longer by not using a body or full length sizing die (these dies work the brass harder). Many people also feel that neck sizing may make your ammo more consistent since it has been fire formed to your chamber.

Seating Die - I think you got this.
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$289/set....OUCH!!

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I’m just starting to load rifle, but the idea of neck sizing makes little sense to me. Performance comes from consistency. Cases will be most consistent just after full length sizing. With each subsequent firing the body and neck change, to address just the neck and leave the body makes no sense to me.

I can see using bushings to size the neck as different brass seems to have different thicknesses.

Am I missing something?
 
Neck sizing applies to bolt guns. When fired the brass forms to the chamber and now is a match to that gun. You can neck size only for a few loadings before the shoulder starts to stretch enough to where it doesn't chamber as well or at all. Then you would full length size or use a body die to bump the shoulder back enough so that it chambers nicely again.

At least that's how I understand it.
 
Gear Head said:
Neck sizing applies to bolt guns. When fired the brass forms to the chamber and now is a match to that gun. You can neck size only for a few loadings before the shoulder starts to stretch enough to where it doesn't chamber as well or at all. Then you would full length size or use a body die to bump the shoulder back enough so that it chambers nicely again.

At least that's how I understand it.
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Agreed, so start with new brass.
First firing the case was fully sized to standard.
Second round is formed to chamber and only neck sized, probably a couple thou longer.
Third firing is another couple thou longer, but the bolt closes and ejection is easy so just neck size.
Fourth firing ejection is difficult, so full length size.

Note the lack of consistency. Wouldn’t it be better to just bump the shoulder back a couple thou after the third firing and for each subsequent firing? The cartridge is fit to your chamber in terms of length and is exactly the same diameter and length for every shot after the third.

Again, I don’t know, just asking the dumb question.
 
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Hornady Lock-N-Load setup is what my wife bought me for father's day a few years ago
 
Gear Head said:
So I don't understand the difference between these other than the micrometers
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I use the Competition sets and they are Type-S resizing dies, but the seating dies has a micrometer. I am less certain about the difference between "Match" and "Competition" die sets. Except it is probably in the resizing dies and what parts of the case are impacted and how well finished they are. But all will use the Type-S resizing set up.

If you go to their instruction sheets, on their web site, and look at the diagrams, you will see that they are the same mechanically. Fit and finish may be different though.
 
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Gear Head said:
So I don't understand the difference between these other than the micrometers

Type S
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/780570/redding-type-s-bushing-3-die-neck-sizer-set

Type S Match
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/585548/redding-type-s-match-bushing-3-die-neck-sizer-set

Competition
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/930915/redding-competition-bushing-3-die-neck-sizer-set
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Mics are the only difderence, and its not a big deal. This is especially true if the dies are for one rifle. The only thing that will change is the seating die.......if you shoot different bullets.
 
BowWow said:
Mics are the only difderence, and its not a big deal. This is especially true if the dies are for one rifle. The only thing that will change is the seating die.......if you shoot different bullets.
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It would help for the load development process. I googled some more and you can buy just the mic for $42-$44 so why is it a $100 jump from the type s to the match?
 
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So how do the LNL and RC handle spent primers? That is one thing I like about my lee turret. Having them pop through the shaft into a tube is nice.

Since the co-ax is out of stock everywhere I'm thinking about just going cheaper on the press and springing for nice redding dies.
 
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I already have hornady dies but I'm not a patient person and idk if I can wait for the coax to come back into stock. I have about 180 various factory rounds to shoot but once I'm through that I'll have lots of hornady brass to play with. Going to Gun Rack tomorrow to snag some h4350 and large rifle primers.
 
A single stage will last a lifetime plus. I bought a used RCBS2 single stage back in the mid 80s and still use it. Check out your local classifieds.

CD
 
Rock Chucker for long life and simplicity. RCBS used to make and may still do a Partner Press that I used for years before getting a RC. I have a set of Forster 6.5CR dies but I think I had to buy an RCBS neck die as Forster die not make one at the time. I found the 6.5CR easy to develop an accurate sub 1/2MOA load for. I would not mess with bushing dies like the Redding type S as my first foray into rifle reloading. I have Redding dies now for a couple bench rest calibers. I like the Forster Micrometer Ultimate seating dies much better than the Redding Micrometer seating die. The Redding has a sliding piston for the bullet tip with a very flimsy C clip keeping it from falling out of the die and the micrometer has a stop pin that interfaces with the piston. With some calibers requiring very little neck tension, I have found the Redding Micrometer to give me inconsistent seating depths. Their regular old seating die works better. Dies are a personal preference thing. Nothing wrong with starting out with Lee dies and just about anybody's single stage press. I use Lee dies for all my pistol reloading. I do not recommend the Lee (collet) neck sizing die but some folks swear by it. I do like their collet crimp die however.
 
Gear Head said:
Neck sizing applies to bolt guns. When fired the brass forms to the chamber and now is a match to that gun. You can neck size only for a few loadings before the shoulder starts to stretch enough to where it doesn't chamber as well or at all. Then you would full length size or use a body die to bump the shoulder back enough so that it chambers nicely again.

At least that's how I understand it.
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You are precisely right above. Neck sizing only or use of sizing dies with bushings also gives you some added fexibility between brass/chamber/and load. When loading hot, 3000 fps and up, you may begin to get brass build up between the shoulder and the case neck (donuts). Donuts become more likely as frequency of shoulder bumping increases. Use of bushings and bushing dies is required if you decide to neck turn because of donuts or simply to improve the neck to chamber tolerances.

.308 brass case neck thickness varies manufacturer to manufacturer by as much as 0.0015" on the nominal measurement and variance within a particular manufacturer can be as much as 0.001" within a single case. Lapua runs 0.0005-7" within a piece of brass. The picture below shows a piece of new Lapua brass turned to 0.014" and clearly shows where the case neck thickness varied. The neck sizing button on the depriming rod will assure that neck diameter is centered on the case, but that simply transfers the variation in neck thickness to the outside dimension of the cartridge. This will affect centering of the case neck within the chamber and ultimately on the bore of the rifle.

Manufacturer to manufacturer variation can be controlled by sorting by head stamp, but donuts may still become a problem after 4-5 loading if running hot loads. The variation within a single case is a concentricity issue and prevents equal jump to lands all the way around the bullet.

This is why bushing dies like the Type-S are so popular with precision rifle reloaders. I am not suggesting neck turning, but if you believe may ever want to, already having bushing dies will reduce the cost of gearing up to do it in the future and gives you greater flexibility in what brass you can use with any given rifle.

Laupua neck turned.jpg
 
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Gear Head said:
So how do the LNL and RC handle spent primers? That is one thing I like about my lee turret. Having them pop through the shaft into a tube is nice.
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That is precisely why I ditched my Lee Challenger press and went with the Lee Classic Turret. When I started wet tumbling, I started using a universal decapper, and having the primers and residue drop down through the center of the ram kept the press cleaner and required much less maintenance. That is also why I would lean towards the Lee Classic Cast non-breechlock single stage press, over the breechlock version, or the Rock Chucker for that matter. Any press that spits the primers out of the side of the ram above the base is going to get dirty much quicker.

jimmyjames8 said:
I like the Forster Micrometer Ultimate seating dies much better than the Redding Micrometer seating die.
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I tend to be a cheapskate, but I splurged and bought a Forster Ultimate seating die for 223 and have not been disappointed. Very precise and less run-out than other dies I've tried, except for possibly the Wilson chamber style seating dies, but they don't mount on a press.
 
Git it!

EDIT: Just make sure it comes with the large/small priming mechanisms and the spent primer chute and bottle!

EDITED: for clarity


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JimB said:
Agreed, so start with new brass.
First firing the case was fully sized to standard.
Second round is formed to chamber and only neck sized, probably a couple thou longer.
Third firing is another couple thou longer, but the bolt closes and ejection is easy so just neck size.
Fourth firing ejection is difficult, so full length size.

Note the lack of consistency. Wouldn’t it be better to just bump the shoulder back a couple thou after the third firing and for each subsequent firing? The cartridge is fit to your chamber in terms of length and is exactly the same diameter and length for every shot after the third.

Again, I don’t know, just asking the dumb question.
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This guy has his opinions:

 
I have been hearing this too. Just FL resize. It does make sense that consistency is better that way than brass that is too large every 3 or so firings.
 
JimB said:
Obviously I like what he’s saying, but is he right? Anyone have an opinion?
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Erik is a friend of mine, he shoots for the US rifle team and builds his own rifles. I perk up when he talks. He holds or use to at least several records.
 
I dunno...... I cant really tell much difference in accuracy between Neck and Full size..... but however I've has some rifle brass that has lasted several loadings. I don't know if it would have lasted so long FL sizing every time. He made a valid point about bumping the shoulder back just enough.

I might take a box of 20 factory ammo and split it 10/10 just for my own NS vs FL experiment. I have the gauge set to measure the shoulder bump, so I could do this.

I did notice that the Forster Benchrest set only includes FL and seater.........
 
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Gear Head said:
Someone sent me this as well..

http://www.larrywillis.com/resizing.html
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He's exactly right about headspace being essential to accuracy in a rifle.
Easiest way to accurately measure headspace and shoulder bump-a-tude is with the RCBS Precision Mic. I have one in .308 and .223 and it lets me accurately measure my chamber headspace in different guns.

I don't mess with all that neck sizing/bushing/turning - last I heard, most people shoot factory ammo and usually quite well. The hand loads I make on a bad day are better than 90% of the factory crap out there.

I have plenty other ways to waste/use my time in the gun room - casting bullets and fondling molds and getting them sized to the chamber correctly.

And I too have a Lee turret press, but I learned how to easily dial out the slop / turret movement - have a dedicated turret to each cartridge you reload and set them up accordingly. That's what they're for.

As far as a single stage press, sure I'll eventually end up with something better but I do rifle reloading, depriming, priming, trimming, a ton of stuff really - on my $40 Lee C reloader with breechlock bushings.

Like the Forster, it has unfettered access to the round you're reloading and I find it works well enough for my needs. I still reload .223 and .300blk on the turret press in indexing mode.
 
Ikarus1 said:
He's exactly right about headspace being essential to accuracy in a rifle.
Easiest way to accurately measure headspace and shoulder bump-a-tude is with the RCBS Precision Mic. I have one in .308 and .223 and it lets me accurately measure my chamber headspace in different guns.

I don't mess with all that neck sizing/bushing/turning - last I heard, most people shoot factory ammo and usually quite well. The hand loads I make on a bad day are better than 90% of the factory crap out there.

I have plenty other ways to waste/use my time in the gun room - casting bullets and fondling molds and getting them sized to the chamber correctly.

And I too have a Lee turret press, but I learned how to easily dial out the slop / turret movement - have a dedicated turret to each cartridge you reload and set them up accordingly. That's what they're for.

As far as a single stage press, sure I'll eventually end up with something better but I do rifle reloading, depriming, priming, trimming, a ton of stuff really - on my $40 Lee C reloader with breechlock bushings.

Like the Forster, it has unfettered access to the round you're reloading and I find it works well enough for my needs. I still reload .223 and .300blk on the turret press in indexing mode.
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How did you minimize the up/down slop? I was thinking of selling it but wouldn't be opposed to keeping it to load 300blk subs
 
Gear Head said:
How did you minimize the up/down slop? I was thinking of selling it but wouldn't be opposed to keeping it to load 300blk subs
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you just dial it out when you're setting up individual dies. Its not a problem really. Setup, measure, do a few dummy rounds and you're gtg
 
I bump my shoulder back by using comparator and slowly screwing the die in. You'll see the brass grow before it starts to come back down. For bolt, bump it back .002-3 and for semi 0.003-4
 
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