Suppressor Wipes...

[bigfelipe]

So Slacker sent me a video of Brooks from Thompson Machine wiping an ISIS II 45 can(posted below). As I've never been terribly happy with the performance of my ISIS II 45 can with smaller caliber bullets, this piqued my interest. I had been toying with the idea of making a metal disc insert for my can with a smaller diameter hole for 9mm/330blk use. I decided for now to try this and see.

The basic concept is, you put a piece of neoprene under the endcap and shoot through it. The result is a smaller hole and better sound suppression dry or wet. It's also a way to carry a wet can without it leaking out before you shoot it.

So I ordered some 3/16 50a neoprene and a 15/16 arch punch per the video and cut some wipes yesterday...

After putting it back together, it leaves a very small gap between the sleeve and endcap. It's not milled for wipes like some cans are. It just makes use of the tiny gap between the endcap and the monocore when it's tightened against the sleeve. I emailed Brooks about it to be sure it wouldn't be an issue. I'll post up after I shoot it with the results...



Here's the punch... Pretty handy tool...


I picked up 2 square feet of the 50a neoprene. This stuff isn't like a wetsuit. It's dense and more rigid. I cut a dozen to test.



Here's a shot of the side to give you an idea of thickness...



Insert inside the back of the endcap like so...

From the front of the endcap...


and screw the cap back on... and shoot right through it...

 

[bigfelipe]

Here's the video and the follow up about 22...

9mm through wiped 45 can

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjhI7_me7u0

22lr through wiped 45 can

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiYgd0IR1jE

 

[bigfelipe]

The pic button is gone again, so I guess I'll just write this out. Pics in post # 13...

So I ran over to PDHSC for some quick testing. Had to test run some new reloads anyhow. Being a small indoor range I didn't bother sound testing. I may see if I can do that Saturday at H2O. This was just a short range accuracy and function test.

Here are my observations on wipes:

1.Lot of blowback... I mean a lot...
2.They wear faster for me than the video showed.
3. They have little effect on accuracy at combat pistol range, best I can tell.
4. I want to try it on a PCC at like 25yds and see how it affects accuracy.

So I loaded up a few mags with 147gr plated over 3.4gr titegroup, 5rds each and shot some slowish strings @ 7yds. Groups were about 1.5-2" when I did my part. Good by me. I checked the 1st wipe after 5rds and took pics. Then I cut it up and installed another one. Checked it after 20rds. Then cut it up and installed a third. Shot another 20 and a some misc other rounds.

The 1st wipe was very clean and evenly cut out. The next couple were a little more uneven and jagged. Not sure if it makes a difference one way or the other.

 

[BigWaylon]

You punching a hole? Or letting the projectile handle it?

 

[bigfelipe]

You punching a hole? Or letting the projectile handle it?

You just shoot through it.

 

[bspitt]

Looking at the shot through holes in the video, the exit side of the "wipe" is smaller than the projectile even after many rounds--which means it is in contact with the bullet on every shot - that has to hurt accuracy and cause tumbling....right????

 

[Chdamn]

Very cool.

But it just out of curiosity. Wouldn't a piece of tape, masking or duct, do the same thing without all the work?

 

[BigWaylon]

Very cool.

But it just out of curiosity. Wouldn't a piece of tape, masking or duct, do the same thing without all the work?

The wipes are generally good for 20-100 shots or so...where a piece of tape wouldn't last but a shot or two. And the tape wouldn't "self heal" like the wipe does.

 

[GymB]

I understand that wipe technology has not evolved because of an ATF ruling that each wipe is an NFA item. No idea if it's true.

Why not not just machine an endcap for each caliber?

 

[BigWaylon]

I understand that wipe technology has not evolved because of an ATF ruling that each wipe is an NFA item. No idea if it's true.

Why not not just machine an endcap for each caliber?

Wipes are not considered suppressor parts. You can buy them online and have them shipped directly to your house. Dead Air offers them with their Ghost. Sold in packs of 10 ($24 on their site)...and it says 100-200 rounds per wipe.

Meanwhile, extra end caps could be considered suppressor parts. The commercial manufacturers that offer them also have an alternate use for them, which make them not solely for suppressor use and thus not suppressor parts.

 

[GymB]

I understand that wipe technology has not evolved because of an ATF ruling that each wipe is an NFA item. No idea if it's true.

Why not not just machine an endcap for each caliber?

Wipes are not considered suppressor parts. You can buy them online and have them shipped directly to your house. Dead Air offers them with their Ghost. Sold in packs of 10 ($24 on their site)...and it says 100-200 rounds per wipe.

Meanwhile, extra end caps could be considered suppressor parts. The commercial manufacturers that offer them also have an alternate use for them, which make them not solely for suppressor use and thus not suppressor parts.

Thanks for killing some additional internet misinformation.

 

[BigWaylon]

I understand that wipe technology has not evolved because of an ATF ruling that each wipe is an NFA item. No idea if it's true.

Why not not just machine an endcap for each caliber?

Wipes are not considered suppressor parts. You can buy them online and have them shipped directly to your house. Dead Air offers them with their Ghost. Sold in packs of 10 ($24 on their site)...and it says 100-200 rounds per wipe.

Meanwhile, extra end caps could be considered suppressor parts. The commercial manufacturers that offer them also have an alternate use for them, which make them not solely for suppressor use and thus not suppressor parts.

Further notes...I believe you're supposed to cut the wipe into four pieces and trash it. That's how the ATF answered the question in one of their letters that gets referenced often.

Not much to the technology, other than maybe a shift in materials.

...and I get a lot of practice killing misinformation as a ARFCOM Mod for the NFA sections.

JimB

 

[Chdamn]

Very cool.

But just out of curiosity. Wouldn't a piece of tape, masking or duct, do the same thing without all the work?

 

[BigWaylon]

Very cool.

But just out of curiosity. Wouldn't a piece of tape, masking or duct, do the same thing without all the work?

Did you miss my answer earlier in the thread?

 

[bigfelipe]

I understand that wipe technology has not evolved because of an ATF ruling that each wipe is an NFA item. No idea if it's true.

Why not not just machine an endcap for each caliber?

I wanted a smaller endcap but was told by Brooks that is illegal.

 

[bigfelipe]

Looking at the shot through holes in the video, the exit side of the "wipe" is smaller than the projectile even after many rounds--which means it is in contact with the bullet on every shot - that has to hurt accuracy and cause tumbling....right????

In one of the videos he says it's not an issue, but I will be checking this out myself. I'll be sure to mention it after I shoot it...

 

[bigfelipe]

I understand that wipe technology has not evolved because of an ATF ruling that each wipe is an NFA item. No idea if it's true.

Why not not just machine an endcap for each caliber?

Wipes are not considered suppressor parts. You can buy them online and have them shipped directly to your house. Dead Air offers them with their Ghost. Sold in packs of 10 ($24 on their site)...and it says 100-200 rounds per wipe.

Meanwhile, extra end caps could be considered suppressor parts. The commercial manufacturers that offer them also have an alternate use for them, which make them not solely for suppressor use and thus not suppressor parts.

Cut in 4 pieces? Weird... $24 for 10 is nuts. I spent $44(22 for the punch,22 for the neoprene) and that's enough for 288 of them... Or about 15 cents per... If I need more it'll be 7cents each.

 

[BigWaylon]

I understand that wipe technology has not evolved because of an ATF ruling that each wipe is an NFA item. No idea if it's true.

Why not not just machine an endcap for each caliber?

Wipes are not considered suppressor parts. You can buy them online and have them shipped directly to your house. Dead Air offers them with their Ghost. Sold in packs of 10 ($24 on their site)...and it says 100-200 rounds per wipe.

Meanwhile, extra end caps could be considered suppressor parts. The commercial manufacturers that offer them also have an alternate use for them, which make them not solely for suppressor use and thus not suppressor parts.

I went back and found the letter I was thinking of, but it didn't mention cutting up the wipe. Either there's a different letter, or I read that fact about some other issue.

 

[bigfelipe]

I understand that wipe technology has not evolved because of an ATF ruling that each wipe is an NFA item. No idea if it's true.

Why not not just machine an endcap for each caliber?

Wipes are not considered suppressor parts. You can buy them online and have them shipped directly to your house. Dead Air offers them with their Ghost. Sold in packs of 10 ($24 on their site)...and it says 100-200 rounds per wipe.

Meanwhile, extra end caps could be considered suppressor parts. The commercial manufacturers that offer them also have an alternate use for them, which make them not solely for suppressor use and thus not suppressor parts.

Brooks emailed me earlier and said to destroy them as you use them. He recommended only cutting one wipe at a time too. I think that's overkill. Time will tell. If they're selling 10packs on the web what's the issue?

 

[bigfelipe]

1st wipe after 5rds





2nd wipe after 20rds




Groups...






for the ATF...

 

[NCLivingBrit]

I came here expecting to see something like:

"Is your suppressor less than fresh?"

"Is range day a funky day?

"Peristent Suppressor Odour is a problem for 85% of Americans. Summer's Eve Suppressor Wipes come in three discreet aromas: Hoppe's #9, Brass Polish and Peppermint Frog"

"Silence your shame, use Summer's Eve Suppressor Wipes."

 

[bigfelipe]

I came here expecting to see something like:

"Is your suppressor less than fresh?"

"Is range day a funky day?

"Peristent Suppressor Odour is a problem for 85% of Americans. Summer's Eve Suppressor Wipes come in three discreet aromas: Hoppe's #9, Brass Polish and Peppermint Frog"

"Silence your shame, use Summer's Eve Suppressor Wipes."

only a Limey.... *shakes head*...

 

[NCLivingBrit]

I came here expecting to see something like:

"Is your suppressor less than fresh?"

"Is range day a funky day?

"Peristent Suppressor Odour is a problem for 85% of Americans. Summer's Eve Suppressor Wipes come in three discreet aromas: Hoppe's #9, Brass Polish and Peppermint Frog"

"Silence your shame, use Summer's Eve Suppressor Wipes."

I think so far outside the box all I can see is a big bag labelled "Iffy Ideas".

 

[JohnFreeman]

Looks good to go thanks for the writeup.

I've got an old Sionics type can for my Mac and need to punch out some wipes. Where did you find the punch?

I think I'll demill the wipes by putting them in the trash...

 

[jkupp2000]

https://www.griffinarmament.com/product-p/garmb.htm
things like this is why you can have different end caps. They don't sell many but because it exist you can swap end caps.
If I remember correctly (and it is 3am so don't hold me to this) I thought the atf ruled wipes = baffles and that the wipes would need to be replaced by the manufacturer as would any other baffle. This is what killed the market in the 80s as baffle design was not what it is today.
I could be wrong but I wouldn't want to be the guy on the web posting about it unless it came from the company that way.

 

[bigfelipe]

https://www.griffinarmament.com/product-p/garmb.htm
things like this is why you can have different end caps. They don't sell many but because it exist you can swap end caps.
If I remember correctly (and it is 3am so don't hold me to this) I thought the atf ruled wipes = baffles and that the wipes would need to be replaced by the manufacturer as would any other baffle. This is what killed the market in the 80s as baffle design was not what it is today.
I could be wrong but I wouldn't want to be the guy on the web posting about it unless it came from the company that way.

The video is from the company that makes the can in question. They lay out the material requirements and how to do it in the video. I've been emailing back and forth with the Brooks from Thompson Machine.

 

[GymB]

https://www.griffinarmament.com/product-p/garmb.htm
things like this is why you can have different end caps. They don't sell many but because it exist you can swap end caps.
If I remember correctly (and it is 3am so don't hold me to this) I thought the atf ruled wipes = baffles and that the wipes would need to be replaced by the manufacturer as would any other baffle. This is what killed the market in the 80s as baffle design was not what it is today.
I could be wrong but I wouldn't want to be the guy on the web posting about it unless it came from the company that way.

Link is to their Revolution Muzzle Break, how does that relate to why we can have different end caps?

 

[BigWaylon]

If I remember correctly (and it is 3am so don't hold me to this) I thought the atf ruled wipes = baffles and that the wipes would need to be replaced by the manufacturer as would any other baffle. This is what killed the market in the 80s as baffle design was not what it is today.
I could be wrong but I wouldn't want to be the guy on the web posting about it unless it came from the company that way.

Looks like we lost a couple answers I'd added. First, to address the above. Wipes are not silencer parts. That's why you can buy them and have them shipped directly to you without any paperwork. Here's one ATF letter that addresses it: ATF letter

and JimB ...the Revolution end caps can be used with the RMB, which makes them not silencer parts because they have alternate uses. Every manufacturer that sells end caps separately has another use for them, even if it's not available to the public. As an example, Jeremy and I both have a SilencerCo product that was a limited production run (I think it was 200 pieces), but never sold to the public. I just happened to run into the guy that had all 200 . It takes an Octane end cap on one end and an Octane mount on the other.

 

[jkupp2000]

Yeah what he said^^^^

 

[JohnFreeman]

That looks remarkably like a ventilated solvent trap !

 

[Lee_Dingle]

Great write up.

Was your suppressor originally designed for wipes or does the end cap just not thread as tightly now?

 

[bigfelipe]

I understand that wipe technology has not evolved because of an ATF ruling that each wipe is an NFA item. No idea if it's true.

Why not not just machine an endcap for each caliber?

The issue is the change of caliber

 

[bigfelipe]

https://www.griffinarmament.com/product-p/garmb.htm
things like this is why you can have different end caps. They don't sell many but because it exist you can swap end caps.
If I remember correctly (and it is 3am so don't hold me to this) I thought the atf ruled wipes = baffles and that the wipes would need to be replaced by the manufacturer as would any other baffle. This is what killed the market in the 80s as baffle design was not what it is today.
I could be wrong but I wouldn't want to be the guy on the web posting about it unless it came from the company that way.

I was referring to the YouTube links I posted at the beginning of the thread

 

[bigfelipe]

Great write up.

Was your suppressor originally designed for wipes or does the end cap just not thread as tightly now?

Not specifically designed for wipes, but there's a little room between the cap and core. It still leaves a tiny gap, but I understand that it's not an issue.