This might be where it starts

T

Tonyd

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Where what starts? Stupid regulations meant to appear to do something while actually accomplishing nothing of value?

I’m perfectly ok with this, on one hand. LEO are civilians. They should be restrained to the exact same restrictions. So let them and the institutions they report to feel the full weight of the stupidity behind this decision and perhaps they will learn something.

I don’t have much faith in them or anyone doing so, but what’s poison for the goose is poison for the gander.
 
They should make them get a carry permit for off duty and they should have to abide by all the ridiculous carry laws, just like the rest of us. Maybe then we will start to see some changes? However, I bet this gets resolved and they continue to be exempt from the laws that regular citizens must follow.
 
SPST said:
They should make them get a carry permit for off duty and they should have to abide by all the ridiculous carry laws, just like the rest of us. Maybe then we will start to see some changes? However, I bet this gets resolved and they continue to be exempt from the laws that regular citizens must follow.
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Ok. So, let me understand you, and I’m honestly asking here,
Police officers, who routinely deal with violent offenders while on duty, should have no additional protections while off duty?

I ask because personally know police officers who have been off duty and run into criminals they had previously arrested.
Case in point, the police offer was out with his family, and didn’t recognize the guy, because it had been routine, and nearly a year before.

Additionally, police officers are not exempt from laws, there are certain statutes that afford them additional protections, such as Hr 218, and LEOSA.
 
Spartan01 said:
Ok. So, let me understand you, and I’m honestly asking here,
Police officers, who routinely deal with violent offenders while on duty, should have no additional protections while off duty?

I ask because personally know police officers who have been off duty and run into criminals they had previously arrested.
Case in point, the police offer was out with his family, and didn’t recognize the guy, because it had been routine, and nearly a year before.

Additionally, police officers are not exempt from laws, there are certain statutes that afford them additional protections, such as Hr 218, and LEOSA.
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He specifically said they should have to endure the same treatments as any non-escalated subject should have to endure.
 
Spartan01 said:
Ok. So, let me understand you, and I’m honestly asking here,
Police officers, who routinely deal with violent offenders while on duty, should have no additional protections while off duty?

I ask because personally know police officers who have been off duty and run into criminals they had previously arrested.
Case in point, the police offer was out with his family, and didn’t recognize the guy, because it had been routine, and nearly a year before.

Additionally, police officers are not exempt from laws, there are certain statutes that afford them additional protections, such as Hr 218, and LEOSA.
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The on-duty officers are surely there to protect them just like they are there to protect all citizens. There is no need for off duty PD to even carry a weapon. :D

They should have the exact same rights as us. If they want more freedom they should vocally support it for all, not just themselves.
 
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CZfool68 said:
The on-duty officers are surely there to protest them jist like they are there to protect all citizens. There is no need for off duty PD to even carry a weapon. :D

They should have the exact same rigths as us. If they want more freedom they should vocally support it for all, not just themselves.
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Sorry if I broke the like button smashing it guys...
 
CZfool68 said:
The on-duty officers are surely there to protect them just like they are there to protect all citizens. There is no need for off duty PD to even carry a weapon. :D

They should have the exact same rights as us. If they want more freedom they should vocally support it for all, not just themselves.
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Umm..
Well...
Aww man!
You got me...
This a valid, accurate, and concise argument.
While I disagree, I admire the fact that you beat me fair and square with a logical argument..

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Spartan01 said:
Umm..
Well...
Aww man!
You got me...
This a valid, accurate, and concise argument.
While I disagree, I admire the fact that you beat me fair and square with a logical argument..

View attachment 91816
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You were not defeated. You were simply temporarily blinded because some of the officers are your friends. That makes it hard to be objective.
 
Spartan01 said:
Ok. So, let me understand you, and I’m honestly asking here,
Police officers, who routinely deal with violent offenders while on duty, should have no additional protections while off duty?

I ask because personally know police officers who have been off duty and run into criminals they had previously arrested.
Case in point, the police offer was out with his family, and didn’t recognize the guy, because it had been routine, and nearly a year before.

Additionally, police officers are not exempt from laws, there are certain statutes that afford them additional protections, such as Hr 218, and LEOSA.
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I believe that they should be able to carry just like me. Why should I have to disarm at a place where a officer doesn't? What about regular citizens that have restraining orders against someone? Could they not also run into them while out and about in a gun free zone? I think we should all be equal. I also think if they start placing these same restrictions on officers, then a lot more officers would be fighting for us all to be able to carry and protect ourselves and families wherever we go.
My son is an officer on a gang unit. I certainly don't want him to be outgunned when off duty. Just like I don't want to be outgunned or unarmed when I am with my grandkids and a gangbanger recognizes that they know who's kids I'm with.
 
There are plenty of people besides police officers who work in bad areas, deal with bad people and have pissed off former customers. None of them have any rights above any other citizen.

Police officers are citizens first. They seem to forget that and want to have rights above and beyond the rest of us.
 
Bailey Boat said:
If the cops you know are still active and aren't carrying, their either idiots or never go out into general population.
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I kind of agree with you.
I mean it’s a personal choice, but as the current laws of HR 218 and LEOSA, allow for off duty carry even in gun free zones, why wouldn’t you take advantage of that?
 
Spartan01 said:
Well, to be fair, cops are people, and there isn’t 10% of the entire population that isn’t lazy.
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You nailed it!!!!!! I get a little [read a lot] put out with Local LEs here because of their entire families being on the Public Tit [teet]. Kinda Biblical, the Begats. One is on the rest come on. This from the imported Chief down.
 
Very good points being made in this thread guys. I work with a number of LE who simply do not carry off duty for reasons I cannot fathom. I know of no other word to describe this but simply...……………...reckless. It's hard for me to even try and understand any logic for not taking steps to protect themselves off duty.
 
Brangus said:
Very good points being made in this thread guys. I work with a number of LE who simply do not carry off duty for reasons I cannot fathom. I know of no other word to describe this but simply...……………...reckless. It's hard for me to even try and understand any logic for not taking steps to protect themselves off duty.
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Exactly.
But also, if the powers that be issued me special privileges that were not held by the rest of the population, why wouldn’t I take advantage of this?
 
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Spartan01 said:
Exactly.
But also, if the powers that be issued me special privileges that were not held by the rest of the population, why wouldn’t I take advantage of this?
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Most people would take advantage of special privileges but another question still remains to be answered.

But simply put here...….why should any citizen regardless of their primary occupation be allowed to have special privileges of self-protection when the rest of us are DENIED the basic rights to protect ourselves?

Are their lives more valuable than mine or my family's ? I'm asking this as a serious question here and not stoking fires. I'm convinced that danger and threats exist in the off-duty world I live in too. And it's my duty as the head of my home to take the necessary measures of mitigating that risk.
 
Spartan01 said:
Exactly.
But also, if the powers that be issued me special privileges that were not held by the rest of the population, why wouldn’t I take advantage of this?
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I won't blame you for taking advantage of it but you should hold no special privileges over your fellow citizens while off duty.
 
Brangus said:
Most people would take advantage of special privileges but another question still remains to be answered.

But simply put here...….why should any citizen regardless of their primary occupation be allowed to have special privileges of self-protection when the rest of us are DENIED the basic rights to protect ourselves?

Are their lives more valuable than mine or my family's ? I'm asking this as a serious question here and not stoking fires. I'm convinced that danger and threats exist in the off-duty world I live in too. And it's my duty as the head of my home to take the necessary measures of mitigating that risk.
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DAMN, where is that BIG like button when I need it?
 
Brangus said:
Most people would take advantage of special privileges but another question still remains to be answered.

But simply put here...….why should any citizen regardless of their primary occupation be allowed to have special privileges of self-protection when the rest of us are DENIED the basic rights to protect ourselves?

Are their lives more valuable than mine or my family's ? I'm asking this as a serious question here and not stoking fires. I'm convinced that danger and threats exist in the off-duty world I live in too. And it's my duty as the head of my home to take the necessary measures of mitigating that risk.
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Well, I agree with you.
I think you should just be allowed to carry a gun all the time. Full stop. That’s what freedoms and liberty is.

My understanding of these laws, are that thru their experiences police officers will develop a spidey sense, and be in a position to react to a threat that an ordinary peasant might not see coming.
Additionally, my understanding of these laws is that it’s not just so they can carry/engage, but so they CAN react, and if they choose to be armed off duty, and they DO NOT react/engage, then they could face repercussions. Obviously that is extremely subjective, and reacting could be as simple as calling 911, which any citizen could do...
 
Spartan01 said:
Exactly.
But also, if the powers that be issued me special privileges that were not held by the rest of the population, why wouldn’t I take advantage of this?
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To respectfully clear the air here...…..my primary occupation is one that requires me to work extremely close to law enforcement personnel in various agencies along with first responders. I'm charged with the responsibility of insuring that risks are mitigated, compliance in all areas is maintained, and we do everything possible to keep them safe and alive each and every day. Quite a bit of my days are spent working with these professionals...….it's what I do.

I take my occupational charge seriously......I try to be effective in my role...…..and earn/maintain the respect of my co-workers throughout all of it. That being said I feel like I owe the rest of the citizenry the very same levels of protection and support for basic rights to self-defense. I really don't see my view of that responsibility changing anytime soon while I'm on this planet.

Another point I'll make here...…….it's my personal objective to see this very internet forum remain a great resource for those like-minded individuals who line up with those beliefs and put them in practice to help others. One resource that I have a tremendous amount of respect for that is present on our site here is the Battery Oaks Compound. I'll defer to @BatteryOaksBilly who can provide any of you awesome CFF members with some life-saving direction while using those resources.

We really are fortunate to have such an awesome group of CFF members to help each other by sharing knowledge, skills, and resources to be able to enjoy a better quality of life while possible.
 
Spartan01 said:
Well, I agree with you.
I think you should just be allowed to carry a gun all the time. Full stop. That’s what freedoms and liberty is.

My understanding of these laws, are that thru their experiences police officers will develop a spidey sense, and be in a position to react to a threat that an ordinary peasant might not see coming.
Additionally, my understanding of these laws is that it’s not just so they can carry/engage, but so they CAN react, and if they choose to be armed off duty, and they DO NOT react/engage, then they could face repercussions. Obviously that is extremely subjective, and reacting could be as simple as calling 911, which any citizen could do...
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I think we're closer in our beliefs and I appreciate knowing that whenever possible private citizens can develop the skills necessary to possess a spidey sense and also be in a position to react to a threat...…….BECAUSE they can see it coming. Training and dedication helps develop that very skill.
 
BatteryOaksBilly said:
You are a wonderful steward of the Forum and I know personally of your compassion for the people in your area. Your work in their behalf is above repute.
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That's very humbling to read sir and I sincerely appreciate your kind words. The awesome members of this great forum deserve no less than the very best because we're only as strong as our membership.

Sadly, I was awakened early this morning with the gut-wrenching news that we had just lost another one of our Lumberton City law enforcement officers while at a scene on Interstate 95.

https://abc11.com/lumberton-police-officer-fatally-struck-while-investigating-crash/4904178/
 
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