Uncle Scotty Stories: Col. Jeff Cooper and Gunfighting
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18DAI
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John Helms, Larry Mudgett, Uncle Scotty Reitz - legends. What they have forgotten about gunfighting most will never even know. All three were decorated LAPD Officers.
John Helms was S.I.S. after SWAT. When those guys spoke, we would sit around like disciples listening to Jesus.
Any serious student of the handgun should own Uncle Scotty's book The Art of Modern Gunfighting. But be advised, once you read it and follow Uncle Scotty, you won't ever want to carry a 9mm handgun again.
Regards 18DAI
John Helms was S.I.S. after SWAT. When those guys spoke, we would sit around like disciples listening to Jesus.
Any serious student of the handgun should own Uncle Scotty's book The Art of Modern Gunfighting. But be advised, once you read it and follow Uncle Scotty, you won't ever want to carry a 9mm handgun again.
Regards 18DAI
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18DAI
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Too many failures to stop the threat. Over the years, Uncle Scotty has provided many examples of 9mm failures to stop, while in use on the street by LAPD. And the round they used for duty was one of the best made, 147 grain RA9T.
When he was Chief firearms instructor for LAPDs METRO Division, which included SIS and SWAT, every Officer carried 45s. For a reason. When dealing with dangerous felons, 45 and 12 guage work best for putting them down quickly. Regards 18DAI
EDITED TO ADD: The answer to the question is not meant to spark an internet gunboard "caliber war". Scott Reitz does NOT denigrate the 9mm, he simply reports the results of its use. And he always encourages students to carry and shoot whatever enables them to get fast accurate hits.
When he was Chief firearms instructor for LAPDs METRO Division, which included SIS and SWAT, every Officer carried 45s. For a reason. When dealing with dangerous felons, 45 and 12 guage work best for putting them down quickly. Regards 18DAI
EDITED TO ADD: The answer to the question is not meant to spark an internet gunboard "caliber war". Scott Reitz does NOT denigrate the 9mm, he simply reports the results of its use. And he always encourages students to carry and shoot whatever enables them to get fast accurate hits.
JT
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Old school thinking. There have been recent significant advances in both projectile and handgun technology. Any gap that ever existed has essentially closed. His opinion is based on a slice of the data pie. Marshall and Sanow suffered from similar blinders. Ellifritz has pretty much closed the book on the handgun 'caliber war'.
As somebody far wiser than I is fond of saying, "Projectile and placement are what matters most" -- or words to that effect.
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I will say ive seen a gold dot 147 +p go through a bedroom wall, into bathroom beside it and through that bathroom mirror, into next room wall and lodged itself in the open door. I know thats not a man, but i was impressed with how much penetration that round had through barriers. I dug out 3 pieces of bullet. Most of the bullet was in tact with the other two pieces being small pieces of the bullet that tore off on last impact im guessing. Always interesting to read about bullet tech. Its good to know whats out there and what you may be up against. Again, thanks. This stuff interests me.
Chuckman
Senior Member
John Helms, Larry Mudgett, Uncle Scotty Reitz - legends. What they have forgotten about gunfighting most will never even know. All three were decorated LAPD Officers.
John Helms was S.I.S. after SWAT. When those guys spoke, we would sit around like disciples listening to Jesus.
Any serious student of the handgun should own Uncle Scotty's book The Art of Modern Gunfighting. But be advised, once you read it and follow Uncle Scotty, you won't ever want to carry a 9mm handgun again.
SIS...shoooo, I don't trust them. I've seen "Training Day."
In all seriousness, they have years--decades--of institutional knowledge. Good stuff.
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18DAI
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Yes. And they both freely imparted their experience and wisdom to anyone willing to listen.
Both Helms and Mudgett were involved in one of the most difficult hostage rescues ever performed by Law Enforcement. My decrepitude makes the date and details hazy now, but an armed perp had three nurses held hostage.
He had them all don hospital scrubs and face masks and put on the same outfit, making target identification and descrimination extremely problematic. All four shuffled out in a single file formation and climbed into a vehicle that had been pulled up in front of their location, per the hostage takers demands.
IIRC, Helms crept up along side the vehicle, identified his target and took him out with one well placed round of 45. Ending the ordeal of the hostages and leaving all three unharmed. Good headwork and precision shooting. Regards 18DAI
Both Helms and Mudgett were involved in one of the most difficult hostage rescues ever performed by Law Enforcement. My decrepitude makes the date and details hazy now, but an armed perp had three nurses held hostage.
He had them all don hospital scrubs and face masks and put on the same outfit, making target identification and descrimination extremely problematic. All four shuffled out in a single file formation and climbed into a vehicle that had been pulled up in front of their location, per the hostage takers demands.
IIRC, Helms crept up along side the vehicle, identified his target and took him out with one well placed round of 45. Ending the ordeal of the hostages and leaving all three unharmed. Good headwork and precision shooting. Regards 18DAI