My M2 Ball came in the last few days as well - same lot number too....Yep. Got the 30 Carbine last year. Got my 30-06 allotment on Saturday.
View attachment 754354
US. Lake CityNo
ETA: Country of origin on the 30.06?
USA - Lake City Ordnance Plant, 1969No
ETA: Country of origin on the 30.06?
Any reason to order from the CMP when same pricing is available on from the commercial market? I priced out .30 cal ammo and it was a wash.
No apologies!Apologies, I just purchased commercial.30 cal ammo. Was not aware of difference b/w mil-surp and commercial ammunition. Is there a difference in performance? Appreciated
In spec and properly greased, but I still won't run commercial ammo through it due to higher chamber pressures...Commercial ammo will not harm your Garand. Make sure your recoil spring is in spec and the rifle is properly greased.
What do you think chamber pressure is going to do to the garand?In spec and properly greased, but I still won't run commercial ammo through it due to higher chamber pressures...
It's pretty well-documented that excessive pressures can, and do, bend and break operating rods regardless of spring rates and the amount of grease applied to the appropriate areas. If it wasn't an issue, there would be no need for variable gas plugs on these rifles.What do you think chamber pressure is going to do to the garand?
Lighter load? As I understand the data, yes, but do your own research and fire whatever you want in YOUR gun.Lots of people have ideas in their heads that are not backed up by evidence. Is WW2 ammo a lighter load than today's ammo? That seems like a good question to have SME talk about. I would be interested in hearing facts. I want to get a Garand and the idea that i have to buy old ammo for my gun seems odd.
Commercial ammo will not harm your Garand. Make sure your recoil spring is in spec and the rifle is properly greased.
What do you think chamber pressure is going to do to the garand?
I want to get a Garand and the idea that i have to buy old ammo for my gun seems odd.
For me, any issue with commercial ammo in a Garand is moot, because there are enough universally accepted "safe" options out there that I have no need to run 200+ grain hunting ammo through any of my Garands. The bigger issue for me is folks buying cheap foreign surplus ammo without researching same and just assuming it is safe because it is for sale on the open market. There have been documented cases of bad lots of Korean surplus ammo and also documented cases of brittle brass failures in some lots of Turkish (MKE) ammo. The formula for safely shooting a Garand really is no different than any other firearm. Keep it in good, properly maintained working order, don't run sketchy ammo in it and don't push its safety limits where there is no need to do so.
I banked a lot of Greek HXP, then added a few crates of Remington and this latest batch of Lake City from CMP. I picked up a few boxes of Turkish MKE somewhere, but it is all getting pulled down and reloaded into HXP brass.Roger that! I buy ONLY Lake City ammo from the 1960s. I have thousands of rounds of it, and my M1 sings a sweet song with it with every trigger pull.......................
I'm curious: why do you pull it all down and reload it?I banked a lot of Greek HXP, then added a few crates of Remington and this latest batch of Lake City from CMP. I picked up a few boxes of Turkish MKE somewhere, but it is all getting pulled down and reloaded into HXP brass.
^^ Blanket statements like this are bad advice. The user manual that the CMP ships with every Garand contains the following statement concerning commercial ammo:
“If commercial 30–06 ammunition is used, select loadings with bullets no heavier than 180 gr. Firing bullets greater than 180 gr is not unsafe, but may develop residual pressures at the gas port near the muzzle. This can damage the operating rod, necessitating its replacement.”
It is well documented that 50,000 PSI (not CUP) is generally safe to use in the M1. The maximum SAAMI pressure for 30-06 is 60,000 PSI which is 10,000 higher.
Hornady, Freedom Munitions, American Eagle, Prvi Partizan, Winchester, etc. wouldn't be producing M1 specific ammo if there was no issue in using any commercial ammo in a Garand.
Schuster Mfg. has been making and selling their popular Schuster Gas Plug to use in the M1 forever. The gas plug's sole purpose for being invented in the first place was to keep the op rod from being battered by the excessive pressure of 50K+ pressure commercial ammo.
I only pull down the MKE. I do not trust the brass, as some of it has been known to fail.I'm curious: why do you pull it all down and reload it?
It's pretty well-documented that excessive pressures can, and do, bend and break operating rods regardless of spring rates and the amount of grease applied to the appropriate areas. If it wasn't an issue, there would be no need for variable gas plugs on these rifles.
Shoot what you'd like to shoot in your rifle; I'll follow the conventional wisdom and not push the issue with my rifle, a rifle that was made some 83 years ago.
The garand was designed in the era of M1 ball. M1 ball is a ~174gr bullet moving around 2600fps measured something like 96ft from the muzzle. It's no slouch. Internet fudd lore has pushed the notion that only M2 ball should be used. John Garand himself didn't them very highly of M2 ball. Also fun fact, most of the ammo issued in WW2 was M2AP, a 165gr bullet at ~2700fps....also no slouch.Lots of people have ideas in their heads that are not backed up by evidence. Is WW2 ammo a lighter load than today's ammo? That seems like a good question to have SME talk about. I would be interested in hearing facts. I want to get a Garand and the idea that i have to buy old ammo for my gun seems odd.
Go argue with your wife or your boyfriend; I'm not interested.If you are using SAAMI spec ammo, it's by definition not "excessive pressure". Plus you mention chamber pressure. Chamber pressure completely irrelevant in the context of the op rod. And go ahead and show me these bent and broken op rods that are a result of using the "wrong ammo". Go ahead. Google is your friend.
A rifle blown apart in that way had some sort of significant failure, not simply using commercial ammo. Sounds of a case head rupture which has been reported in some lots of MKE ammo.On the "sketchy ammo" theme: I was at James River Armory (JRA) in Burgaw, NC yesterday (Mar 14) talking with Mark and Spencer about many things, but we covered Garand ammo, chamber pressures, and what can "go wrong". Keep in mind that JRA not only restores military rifles, and has for decades, but manufactures reproductions to exacting specifications as well.
They showed me photos of an M1 rifle they just repaired that had the stock blown apart and op-rod destroyed by an owner using ammo from which the source was unknown (may have even been reloads in the mix of cartridges given to the owner in a bag and fired on the day of the damage). JRA was able to repair the rifle, but the ordeal highlighted what can "go wrong" with the wrong ammo. They also pointed out that chamber pressure increasing from 50,000psi to 60,000psi is, after all, a full 20% increase in pressure and that's NOT insignificant!
Explain chamber pressure's affect on the op rod.Go argue with your wife or your boyfriend; I'm not interested.
If you don't understand chamber pressures, that's on you.
Last, Google is NOT anyone's friend.
Maybe you should do some research on both subjects. Good day.
Right. Going by CMPs own statement, that includes all SAAMI spec 30-06 ammo. And where is it stated the Garand is limited to 50k psi?^^ Blanket statements like this are bad advice. The user manual that the CMP ships with every Garand contains the following statement concerning commercial ammo:
“If commercial 30–06 ammunition is used, select loadings with bullets no heavier than 180 gr. Firing bullets greater than 180 gr is not unsafe, but may develop residual pressures at the gas port near the muzzle. This can damage the operating rod, necessitating its replacement.”
It is well documented that 50,000 PSI (not CUP) is generally safe to use in the M1. The maximum SAAMI pressure for 30-06 is 60,000 PSI which is 10,000 higher.
Hornady, Freedom Munitions, American Eagle, Prvi Partizan, Winchester, etc. wouldn't be producing M1 specific ammo if there was no issue in using any commercial ammo in a Garand.
Schuster Mfg. has been making and selling their popular Schuster Gas Plug to use in the M1 forever. The gas plug's sole purpose for being invented in the first place was to keep the op rod from being battered by the excessive pressure of 50K+ pressure commercial ammo.
He specifically stated that it was not commercial ammo. It was some sketchy stuff the dude found.A rifle blown apart in that way had some sort of significant failure, not simply using commercial ammo. Sounds of a case head rupture which has been reported in some lots of MKE ammo.
Yeah there usually is alaways somebody on here with the answer that you are looking for.I'm impressed by the amount of knowledge out there in this community if I do ever decide to get a Garand (likely). To answer the question about M1 .30 carbine ammo, I most recently have purchased from a company called AEAmmo out of Indiana for about $33/box of 50 for FMJ rounds ($0.66/rd). They have flat rate shipping at $15 I believe.
Right. Going by CMPs own statement, that includes all SAAMI spec 30-06 ammo. And where is it stated the Garand is limited to 50k psi?
Right. Going by CMPs own statement, that includes all SAAMI spec 30-06 ammo. And where is it stated the Garand is limited to 50k psi?
Its not really documented at all...It's pretty well-documented that excessive pressures can, and do, bend and break operating rods regardless of spring rates and the amount of grease applied to the appropriate areas.
If it wasn't an issue, there would be no need for variable gas plugs on these rifles.
conventional wisdom can be wrong....Shoot what you'd like to shoot in your rifle; I'll follow the conventional wisdom and not push the issue with my rifle, a rifle that was made some 83 years ago.
military 30-06 and commercial 30-06 both have the same max limits for chamber pressure... 50k CUP or 60k psi depending on which book you look into. Port pressures are also similar across the board.Lots of people have ideas in their heads that are not backed up by evidence. Is WW2 ammo a lighter load than today's ammo? That seems like a good question to have SME talk about. I would be interested in hearing facts. I want to get a Garand and the idea that i have to buy old ammo for my gun seems odd.