4 stamps in a day, now which mounting system?

Sasquatch

Sasquatch

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Somehow the ATF managed to get 250k people to fill out Form 1s to be processed, and still were able to get my 4x Form 4s approved in 7 weeks (eform). It was like Christmas in August when my FFL let me know they trickled in over an 8 hour period. Did they suddenly upgrade from Windows 95? Reminds me of how it takes 12 weeks to get a passport renewed, but I managed to get one in 4 hours with my Senator's help.

Anyway, now I have 3 cans which use the 'HUB' system which means for any given muzzle device and adapter, I can move between them. There's still the proprietary aspect that the mount needs to interface with the adapter, so you'll need one adapter per-can, but you're not locked into the can itself.

I have invested in Griffin Armament as my existing can uses its taper mount system. It's not a hub compatible can on its own, but they do sell "Plan A" which allows other cans to use Griffin muzzle devices. This taper system is where I'm leaning as I have 3 or 4 taper muzzle devices for both 223 and 308 threads.

But, it's not the best design. Even though it's a taper, the threads are inside the can, which means they get carboned up. Secondly, it's right-handed- so those carboned-up threads mean I'm potentially uncrewing the can from the hub, or the muzzle device from the barrel instead of the adapter from the muzzle device. Third- there are no wrench flats, so if my muzzle device gets locked I'll have to get clever to get it out of the can after twisting it off the barrel.

The other option I'm looking at is the DA Xeno. It solves all the above- it's a taper, screws on left-handed (and 'tightens' the other stuff when you take it off). The threads are behind the taper, so no carbon on them. For the devices I've seen, they also have wrench flats if needed.

The only downside to the Xeno seems to be availability- there are only a couple of options- a minimalist nub, an a2-ish flash hider, and a q-ish diffuser. At least one company (forward controls?) makes a small muzzle brake. Compared to the Griffin line, they have just about everything.

I hear Rearden also has a good system, but I don't know much about them.

Should I go with Griffin, or the better design of Xeno, or a different option altogether?
 
YHM Kurz. I like all the moving parts being on the mount, not the can/adapter.

That’s what I’d do.

Of course, I’d do almost anything to not give Griffin a dime, but that’s for personal reasons.
 
Actually, what I’d do knowing what I know now…

Is go direct thread on every one, and have a can for every host. I have one for every host at this point, and wasted a lot of money on QD systems to get there.
 
BigWaylon said:
Actually, what I’d do knowing what I know now…

Is go direct thread on every one, and have a can for every host. I have one for every host at this point, and wasted a lot of money on QD systems to get there.
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That's a good point- and I'm actually one 'suppressor' ahead of guns I want to shoot suppressed. So my son has one on his hunting 308 now (direct).

But- cans mounted on my barrels have trouble fitting in my safe (the RPR has a folding stock which helped), and taking off a can means I need to put something on the barrel so I don't screw up the threads.

One of the cans I got is a YHM (Turbo K) and it's a HUB can- and the muzzle device is an effective brake (or it's loud, same thing). I am unconvinced the clicky-thing engages properly. I'll look into the one you mention above. I was not planning on moving the Turbo around because it's a dedicated .223 while my other cans are 308, and I actually don't want to move it potentially somewhere it could blow up.
 
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Sasquatch said:
That's a good point- and I'm actually one 'suppressor' ahead of guns I want to shoot suppressed. So my son has one on his hunting 308 now (direct).

But- cans mounted on my barrels have trouble fitting in my safe (the RPR has a folding stock which helped), and taking off a can means I need to put something on the barrel so I don't screw up the threads.

One of the cans I got is a YHM (Turbo K) and it's a HUB can- and the muzzle device is an effective brake (or it's loud, same thing). I am unconvinced the clicky-thing engages properly. I'll look into the one you mention above. I was not planning on moving the Turbo around because it's a dedicated .223 while my other cans are 308, and I actually don't want to move it potentially somewhere it could blow up.
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What makes you think the clicky-thing isn’t engaging properly? You do know that’s just a secondary system, and the can ought to stay tight even if you cut that ring off?

Thread protectors are cheap if you have to remove the cans each time. But I also think (some) people worry too much about damaging threads. You could even just cut short pieces of PVC and glue a cap on each one, and just slide them over the muzzle…or many other similar options.
 
Ok yes- I did some more reading on the YHM mounts, and though the finish is basement-shop quality, the price is right, and they have a lot of muzzle devices. Also, it meets the criteria of threads-behind-the-taper.
 
I’d still like to know what makes you think yours isn’t working right.
 
BigWaylon said:
I’d still like to know what makes you think yours isn’t working right.
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My mistake (after watching videos)- it is a taper mount/friction. The clicky as you say is just a secondary. But putting it on feels loose until you really crank on it. I've only had it for a day and it just didn't seem secure.
 
The only issue I’ve had (which was expected) was putting a 5.56 can on a .30 flash hider (which was on a 5.56 host). Taper engaged and it shot fine, but no contact with the teeth.

This is one of best videos out there, in case you haven’t seen it.

 
BigWaylon said:
The only issue I’ve had (which was expected) was putting a 5.56 can on a .30 flash hider (which was on a 5.56 host). Taper engaged and it shot fine, but no contact with the teeth.

This is one of best videos out there, in case you haven’t seen it.

Click to expand...

Yep, that's one of the videos I watched- was good with the cutaways.

How'd you manage to get a 30 flash hider on a 5.56 host- thread pitches are different? But more to the point- the interface is different between 5.56 and 30 for the YHM mounts? I did see that the 'new' muzzle devices have two turns of thread instead of 3? One of my fears is grabbing the turbo k (5.56) and it ending up on a 30 cal...

 
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Sasquatch said:
Should I go with Griffin, or the better design of Xeno, or a different option altogether?
Click to expand...

I'm a big fan of the Xeno design. I run it on almost everything. The exception is pistol caliber stuff. I DID run it on a sub gun, but switched back to 3 lug on that.

As you said, Dead Air sucks and don't have enough of them manufactured, so they're perpetually out of stock. BUT, LMT makes can adapters and muzzle devices in the Xeno pattern for HUB threaded cans.
 
Sasquatch said:
Yep, that's one of the videos I watched- was good with the cutaways.

How'd you manage to get a 30 flash hider on a 5.56 host- thread pitches are different? But more to the point- the interface is different between 5.56 and 30 for the YHM mounts? I did see that the 'new' muzzle devices have two turns of thread instead of 3? One of my fears is grabbing the turbo k (5.56) and it ending up on a 30 cal...

Click to expand...

I don’t even know if they sell different sized mounts anymore?

They used to sell 5.56 and 7.62 mounts…but you could buy the 7.62 mounts in 1/2-28 and 5/8-24 so you could use the .30 can on both calibers. Mine were specifically made for the LT & ULT, which are 7.62 cans. The muzzle devices were shorter than the original Phantom MB/FH. Used to be really long options for there .30 mounts.

The mounts looked identical…but we’re just enough different that the 5.56 can wouldn’t turn all the way down.
 
Sasquatch said:
Somehow the ATF managed to get 250k people to fill out Form 1s to be processed, and still were able to get my 4x Form 4s approved in 7 weeks (eform). It was like Christmas in August when my FFL let me know they trickled in over an 8 hour period. Did they suddenly upgrade from Windows 95? Reminds me of how it takes 12 weeks to get a passport renewed, but I managed to get one in 4 hours with my Senator's help.

Anyway, now I have 3 cans which use the 'HUB' system which means for any given muzzle device and adapter, I can move between them. There's still the proprietary aspect that the mount needs to interface with the adapter, so you'll need one adapter per-can, but you're not locked into the can itself.

I have invested in Griffin Armament as my existing can uses its taper mount system. It's not a hub compatible can on its own, but they do sell "Plan A" which allows other cans to use Griffin muzzle devices. This taper system is where I'm leaning as I have 3 or 4 taper muzzle devices for both 223 and 308 threads.

But, it's not the best design. Even though it's a taper, the threads are inside the can, which means they get carboned up. Secondly, it's right-handed- so those carboned-up threads mean I'm potentially uncrewing the can from the hub, or the muzzle device from the barrel instead of the adapter from the muzzle device. Third- there are no wrench flats, so if my muzzle device gets locked I'll have to get clever to get it out of the can after twisting it off the barrel.

The other option I'm looking at is the DA Xeno. It solves all the above- it's a taper, screws on left-handed (and 'tightens' the other stuff when you take it off). The threads are behind the taper, so no carbon on them. For the devices I've seen, they also have wrench flats if needed.

The only downside to the Xeno seems to be availability- there are only a couple of options- a minimalist nub, an a2-ish flash hider, and a q-ish diffuser. At least one company (forward controls?) makes a small muzzle brake. Compared to the Griffin line, they have just about everything.

I hear Rearden also has a good system, but I don't know much about them.

Should I go with Griffin, or the better design of Xeno, or a different option altogether?
Click to expand...

I’ve been using Griffins cans and mount since 2015 and haven’t had an issue I didn’t create (over tightening by hand) and the LH threads for a pistol can didn’t solve those problems of backing off, Teflon tape did. I wouldn’t worry about the RH threads in the Plan A

Griffin offers a huge selection of mounts, basically anything you could possibly want in size, length, weight, comp, flash, whatever

I personally have two direct thread rifle cans left. I rarely use them a) due to older designs being heavier and not as quiet and b) sometimes having the can on isn’t ideal and then I’ve just got plain muzzle threads. I might eventually pin them on some type of durable barrel, a 10.3” 5.56 and an 8” 300BLK, and make perm attached shorties with them.
 
Took me a while to understand, cuz I'm an idiot, but the issue with the yhm qd mounts are easily solved. The locking ring on the muzzle devices have a small amount of play left to right. When you tighten the can on of course it turns the locking ring to its furthest position. That position may not allow locking teeth to index properly with can when the can is tight to taper. Solution is to tighten can normally, then while holding can tight turn lock ring backwards to click into place. And this is only needed on some muzzle devices as some index well and some don't. I have 2 that are perfect and one I have to hold can and grab ring with vise grips and turn back. I like the system, can isn't coming loose under hard use and offers repeatability.
 
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