Good evening, not sure if this belongs in the gunsmith section or not, but here goes. Last Christmas my wife bought me my first Ar-15. I haven’t had time to shoot it as much as I’ve wanted, but I seem to have a recurring problem, when I load in a magazine whether it has thirty rounds or five . The first time the trigger is pulled, the firing pin dimples the primer, but no “BANG”. I don’t let the charging handle go easily. I have taken apart the BCG, cleaned , and reassembled. The gas key seemed to be in good shape. But if I tap the forward assist before pulling the trigger the symptoms go away. Is there anything I’m overlooking. Is there a certain amount of break in that’s normal. (Probably less than 200 rounds through it thus far). Also, it’s not a specific brand, seems a collection of parts, I know it’s a bear creek upper. Any advise or help would be appreciated to eliminate this first shot/no shoot situation.
An Ar-15 question
- Thread starter Uncle Yo
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Does locking the bolt back and using the release make any difference? Don't ease the CH at all, pull it all the way back and just let go.
Make sure it's lubed, not dripping, but lubed well.
Shoot it or cycle it more, whatever is hanging it up will wear. I would think 200rnds would have done it, but something must be pretty mismatched.
Make sure it's lubed, not dripping, but lubed well.
Shoot it or cycle it more, whatever is hanging it up will wear. I would think 200rnds would have done it, but something must be pretty mismatched.
OP
Uncle Yo
Active Member
I do pull CH back , and let her fly. I keep it lubed. But forgot to mention, after the first shot goes off, it will run smooth as glass until you stop pulling trigger. Then typically, the next depression of the trigger.......click! This would be bad in a hunting, or defense scenario.
Explain this a bit more when you have this issue...
Only when loading with the charging handle?
No issues letting the bolt slam when released?
Do you shoot, reload, shoot, with no issues. Then empty, check targets. When cool you load again and have the issue?
Field strip the BCG and clean the internal channels with a cleaner to remove any grease. Oil, reassemble and try again.
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nbkky71
Well-Known Member
So, in summary:
Possibly a gas tube alignment issue? Disassemble the bolt and insert just the bolt carrier carrier into the rifle. you should be able to tell if the carrier is aligning with the gas tube by sliding it by hand. If there's interference then you might need to tweak the position of the gas tube
Cam pin issue? if the cam pin is binding in any way, that would prevent the bolt from engaging the barrel extension
Out of spec bolt? Any deformation on the locking lugs? that might indicate an out-of-spec part.
If you have spare parts, try swapping the bolt internals one at a time to see if the problem goes away (cam pin, bolt & carrier).
- BCG is cleaned & properly lubed
- You insert a loaded magazine
- You pull the charging handle to the rear and release it to chamber a round
- You pull trigger and CLICK.
- But if you tap the forward assist before pulling the trigger, then it goes BANG
- Subsequent rounds fire from the magazine without issue
- When you reload the same symptoms occur
Possibly a gas tube alignment issue? Disassemble the bolt and insert just the bolt carrier carrier into the rifle. you should be able to tell if the carrier is aligning with the gas tube by sliding it by hand. If there's interference then you might need to tweak the position of the gas tube
Cam pin issue? if the cam pin is binding in any way, that would prevent the bolt from engaging the barrel extension
Out of spec bolt? Any deformation on the locking lugs? that might indicate an out-of-spec part.
If you have spare parts, try swapping the bolt internals one at a time to see if the problem goes away (cam pin, bolt & carrier).
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Says right at the bottom of that post that it's a collection of parts
Ikarus1
Avtomat Krishna-kov
I suspect Milspec ammo and light strikes. I would look HARD at the hammer spring. If it's weak, or a JP 'yellow' it may not set off milspec primers.
But tapping the FA means it's not fully into battery. Gas tube alignment certainly could be the issue especially if it's a homebuild. Probably the reason someone got rid of it.
But tapping the FA means it's not fully into battery. Gas tube alignment certainly could be the issue especially if it's a homebuild. Probably the reason someone got rid of it.
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OP
Uncle Yo
Active Member
Thanks folks, want to add a little more info, this was a “newly assembled “ rifle, never been shot before. There may have been some assembly lube somewhere , a part not fit correctly during assembly etc.. But, the first time I removed BCG, to clean and lube, the cam pin was so tight I had to use pliers to remove it. I feel I didn’t damage anything because I covered with a heavy cloth to help protect and grip the pin. After cleaning and lube I could rotate into position with my fingers. As far as ammo all I’ve shot through it was .223 no .556. I think it was American Eagle.
Try a replacement recoil/buffer spring. If the spring isn't to spec it may not have enough 'oomph' to power feed a round and rotate the bolt from the retracted position but when it is fired there is enough momentum off of the buffer to give 'er a shove and get the bolt closed.
Also, try a different magazine first. If the magazine is slightly out of spec feeding the top round from a full magazine may slow the bolt group enough to stop it from fully closing. Subsequent rounds have less pressure slowing the BCG and allow the full functioning of the action.
Also, try a different magazine first. If the magazine is slightly out of spec feeding the top round from a full magazine may slow the bolt group enough to stop it from fully closing. Subsequent rounds have less pressure slowing the BCG and allow the full functioning of the action.
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Joshua Needham
Well-Known Member
I work on AR-15 platform guns every week and am a certified AR-15 M4 Armorer among other things so trust me on this.
Use the bolt release when loading, not the charging handle.
I know lots of people use the charging handle, but using the charging handle is inviting human error, and often causes issues with many users.
It is a push feed design so the bolt has to slam hard to overpower both the extractor and ejector springs.
If the bolt is not locked fully the firing pin is not long enough to reach the primer and detonate it.
This is a internal safety so do not try to override the internal travel stop.
Note the location of the bolt carrier when fully closed vs partially rearward.
Inspect this before attempting to fire rather than after, as the falling hammer can nudge it the rest of the way.
Regardless of whether or not it fixes your issue, only use the charging handle to open your bolt moving forward, not to close it.
If that doesn't work get back to me, and I will give you some more things to check.
This is simply the most likely solution, and easiest to inspect as a user.
Use the bolt release when loading, not the charging handle.
I know lots of people use the charging handle, but using the charging handle is inviting human error, and often causes issues with many users.
It is a push feed design so the bolt has to slam hard to overpower both the extractor and ejector springs.
If the bolt is not locked fully the firing pin is not long enough to reach the primer and detonate it.
This is a internal safety so do not try to override the internal travel stop.
Note the location of the bolt carrier when fully closed vs partially rearward.
Inspect this before attempting to fire rather than after, as the falling hammer can nudge it the rest of the way.
Regardless of whether or not it fixes your issue, only use the charging handle to open your bolt moving forward, not to close it.
If that doesn't work get back to me, and I will give you some more things to check.
This is simply the most likely solution, and easiest to inspect as a user.
OP
Uncle Yo
Active Member
Update: I was able to discuss the problems I was having with my rifle with some local guys at a bbq last weekend. One of the men told me to stop it by his house sometime, he would take a look at it. I stopped a couple days later, after checking it over, a weak hammer spring was diagnosed. He replaced it with a new one and it has been working fine. Had no idea, pays to have friends .
OP
Uncle Yo
Active Member
I wish I had taken a picture, the best way for me to describe the issue was: The concentric spirals on one half of the spring were not even. (Hope that makes sense!) My friend said that was causing a light primer strike. I have no grounds to argue that...it works now!
Combat Diver
Well-Known Member
I had something similar last week on the range. 10th MTN soldier was getting light strikes in the middle of the magazine. Immediately I'm thinking hammer spring. Open her up and the hammer spring was installed upside down (leg over top, not bottom). See diagram. Keep the BCG lubed when firing. Glad you got it figured out.
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