Gov Pooper-Cooper Vetoed SB41 to Repeal PPP - Will the veto be overridden?

Will Cooper’s veto be overridden?

  • Yes

    Votes: 29 25.0%

  • No

    Votes: 47 40.5%

  • I like turtles

    Votes: 40 34.5%
  • Total voters
    116
  • Poll closed .
BatteryOaksBilly said:
Congratulations to you all for getting rid of this nonsense.....So now, like here, you can buy and sell between each other by only establishing residence??
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i gotta be honest with you man, i can't even guarantee i've done that much on all my private transactions.
I get that new gun fever, or cash fever, and i just start forgetting things. I may have forgotten to pay a fella a time or two until I was about to leave and felt like i was forgetting something.
 
Sasquatch said:
No, but people have been harassed by the ATF, even though they broke no law. So I'll be checking IDs, tyvm. Heck, on this forum most sales say "must show ID, sign bill of sale, etc.", so I'm not the only one wanting to be careful.
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don't worry, over in the supporting members area we have a whole thread just for making fun of people that ask for extra stuff like this. Be as careful as you want.
 
Joel said:
For all of you that are perfectly fine selling a firearm to some unknown unidentified person. If that firearm is ever used in crime and in the possession of Law Enforcement, a trace will very likely be run and the firearm will be traced as far as it can be traced. If that trace ends with you and you tell LE that you sold the gun and have no other information then legally maybe you are good. But, what is the harm with collecting the ID of the buyer so you can provide that information to LE which possibly will help LE solve the crime. Any reasonable buyer will not have a issue with a Bill of Sale and providing their identity. I think most of us gun owners do want to see felons and murderers in jail, do we not?
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I don't think you understand some of us
One day I was especially grumpy about gun laws, so I gave away a pile of parts to build an AR, including the serialized receiver i had bought on a 4473, to some guy i didn't know from a different forum and then immediately deleted all forum messages and text messages from him on my phone. My only requirement was that he said he was legally able to own it. Even the handshake at the end was optional.
I don't want him to do a crime, but i wouldn't have cared if he did because I wanted the cops to come ask about it so i could cuss them out and tell them to write their suspicions about me on some 40 grit sand paper and then stuff them where the sun doesn't shine.

Don't go asking me what harm could it do, because i've already spent time in court for just helping the police do their jobs when i wasn't doing anything wrong.
 
Joel said:
For all of you that are perfectly fine selling a firearm to some unknown unidentified person. If that firearm is ever used in crime and in the possession of Law Enforcement, a trace will very likely be run and the firearm will be traced as far as it can be traced. If that trace ends with you and you tell LE that you sold the gun and have no other information then legally maybe you are good. But, what is the harm with collecting the ID of the buyer so you can provide that information to LE which possibly will help LE solve the crime. Any reasonable buyer will not have a issue with a Bill of Sale and providing their identity. I think most of us gun owners do want to see felons and murderers in jail, do we not?
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Thank you for helping me realize I have entered the ranks of unreasonable buyers who have issues with Bills of Sale. :)
 
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Joel said:
I do have a Chapel Hill address. Durham County, born and raised in this area. Ultra Conservative, believe it or not everyone in this area does not have the same ideology. I have a Firearms business, I have a FFL and have owned and used firearms for many decades. It is a real shame that one can not share opinions and make reasonable statements on this forum without some members calling them out for where they live and making assumptions about them.
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I was not actually suggesting that you are an LGBTPEDO flag-bearer, but I'm sorry if that went too far. The joke was just to make fun of Chapel Hill generally (I do actually see that heinous monstrosity flown all over the place when I have the rare misfortune of being in that town).

Edit: To be clear, I still agree with the other members here. I don't think claiming to be pro-2A while simultaneously telling us we should be imposing unnecessary burdens on our own legal firearm transactions is a reasonable (or "ultra-conservative") position, but we can agree to disagree.
 
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Joel said:
It is a real shame that one can not share opinions and make reasonable statements on this forum without some members calling them out for where they live and making assumptions about them.
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To be fair, you are kind of judgy about what you think private citizens ought to do beyond what the law requires.
 
DCGallim said:
I’m willing to bet your version of ultra conservative is Democrat from 10 years ago. My version of Ultra Conservative is a bit too strong for most people’s taste.
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How about…

Most of the fed gov is unconstitutional and should be dismantled. “No infringement” and that includes requiring serial numbers on weapons, much less any sort of gov approval on purchase for anyone, much less tracking of ownership and transfers.
 
JimP42 said:
How about…

Most of the fed gov is unconstitutional and should be dismantled. “No infringement” and that includes requiring serial numbers on weapons, much less any sort of gov approval on purchase for anyone, much less tracking of ownership and transfers.
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That's not ultra-conservative, that's just basic reading comprehension and the experience of having read our constitution.

I'll go further. The 13th, 14th, and 15th amendments to the U.S. Constitution were ratified by states under duress (military occupation of the southern states by the north). Those amendments must be acknowledged as illegitimate and therefore rendered null and void for that reason, or else the South must be fully recognized as an independent nation (meaning southern ratification of those amendments would no longer have been required in order to achieve a 3/4 ratio among the United States).

None of this is to convey any opinion on the contents of those amendments; that's a whole other topic (obligatory "I condemn slavery entirely", except for prison labor).
 
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DuncanLempRIP said:
That's not ultra-conservative, that's just basic reading comprehension and the experience of having read our constitution.
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While I agree, that’s what “ultra-conservative” means these days.

My points were by no means a complete list, just a couple of highlights. Another would be “taxation is theft” :)
 
JimP42 said:
While I agree, that’s what “ultra-conservative” means these days.

My points were by no means a complete list, just a couple of highlights. Another would be “taxation is theft” :)
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Our current system of taxation is not theft…it is armed robbery.
 
DCGallim said:
I’m willing to bet your version of ultra conservative is Democrat from 10 years ago. My version of Ultra Conservative is a bit too strong for most people’s taste.
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bro, your version is shade shy of...well...nevermind
 
B00ger said:
bro, your version is shade shy of...well...nevermind
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I’m not going to deny that statement. It didn’t start that way, deep down I just want live and let live. For everyone to be free to have their own lives not infringing on everyone else’s. But over the last 10-12 years I’ve come to the realization that it’s not an option. So it’s total victory or total defeat no in between.
 
Joel said:
So are you saying you do not care to help our LE solve crimes? I guess that is OK but not where most people I associate with stand.
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Is their pension, income, and benefits being pulled out of my tax dollars not enough to fund their crime solving budget?

Maybe they could come up with some scheme for shaking folks down on the side of the road for extra revenue.

Joel said:
I think most of us gun owners do want to see felons and murderers in jail, do we not?
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I would like to see them ground into paste 5 minutes after their conviction, personally.

But go ahead and give an instance where a BOS put a murderer behind bars.
 
Derek8404 said:
That was my first thought. The BST pistol section is about to get hilarious. A lot of true fudds are about to reveal themselves…
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I’m going to require a week long sleepover (me staying at your house of course) as a character test.

If you can tolerate that and don’t try to kill me you’re probably good to go!


Anybody need a hi-point?
 
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DuncanLempRIP said:
I'll go further. The 13th, 14th, and 15th amendments to the U.S. Constitution were ratified by states under duress (military occupation of the southern states by the north). Those amendments must be acknowledged as illegitimate and therefore rendered null and void for that reason, or else the South must be fully recognized as an independent nation (meaning southern ratification of those amendments would no longer have been required in order to achieve a 3/4 ratio among the United States).
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NC was not yet back in the union when those three amendments were ratified.

President Johnson required ratification of the 13th before allowing readmission, but NC was not readmitted after ratifying.

Congress required former Confederate states to ratify the 14th as a condition of regaining federal representation. They overturned Johnson's veto to enact this.

Although technically part of the union after ratifying the 14th, military occupation and military courts did not end until 1877.

Each of the three amendments gave Congress the power to enforce the provisions of the amendments by legislation, which some feared gave Congress the power to legislate rights of citizens.

So, yes, ratification of the 13th, 14th and 15th was under duress.
 
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Joel said:
For all of you that are perfectly fine selling a firearm to some unknown unidentified person. If that firearm is ever used in crime and in the possession of Law Enforcement, a trace will very likely be run and the firearm will be traced as far as it can be traced. If that trace ends with you and you tell LE that you sold the gun and have no other information then legally maybe you are good. But, what is the harm with collecting the ID of the buyer so you can provide that information to LE which possibly will help LE solve the crime. Any reasonable buyer will not have a issue with a Bill of Sale and providing their identity. I think most of us gun owners do want to see felons and murderers in jail, do we not?
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Joel said:
So are you saying you do not care to help our LE solve crimes? I guess that is OK but not where most people I associate with stand.
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I am pretty sure that most of us don't want to see anyone get hurt in a gun-related incident, especially if it was with a gun we own(ed). But make your argument another way, and see how it sounds: I am going to sell a used car, but I want proof that the buyer doesn't drink alcohol, because if the buyer gets into a wreck with a car I otherwise legally sold, I will be held criminally responsible. And most of us car owners do not want to see felons and murderers in jail, do we not?

It's not false equivalency, it is the same argument.

Going the extra step may make you feel better, and if it's ("it" being a BOS, copy of the DL, a buyer-paid background check, whatever) what you need to make you feel better, then do it. You gotta sleep at night. But that doesn't negate the law's requirements, nor does it mean people who follow the law are encouraging aiding and abetting criminal behavior for doing something the law does not require.
 
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Joel said:
For all of you that are perfectly fine selling a firearm to some unknown unidentified person. If that firearm is ever used in crime and in the possession of Law Enforcement, a trace will very likely be run and the firearm will be traced as far as it can be traced. If that trace ends with you and you tell LE that you sold the gun and have no other information then legally maybe you are good. But, what is the harm with collecting the ID of the buyer so you can provide that information to LE which possibly will help LE solve the crime. Any reasonable buyer will not have a issue with a Bill of Sale and providing their identity. I think most of us gun owners do want to see felons and murderers in jail, do we not?
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Lets start with the murderers and felons in the ATF and FBI in jail, and then work our way down to the small stuff. You ok with that?

I still say it is lunacy to make it either a moral or a legal requirement to place a burden on me (the seller) which is neither morally defensible nor legally required. I cannot be held morally responsible for what a person may do with an item (any item... should I be expected to keep a "record of sale" for an axe? A ball peen hammer?) once it is sold.
 
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Joel said:
For all of you that are perfectly fine selling a firearm to some unknown unidentified person. If that firearm is ever used in crime and in the possession of Law Enforcement, a trace will very likely be run and the firearm will be traced as far as it can be traced. If that trace ends with you and you tell LE that you sold the gun and have no other information then legally maybe you are good.
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Yeah. Maybe. Because you can never be too sure, right?
 
Just wondering, everytime I bought PPP's I would have to go to the sheriff's dept. And sign a Mental Records Release Form. I'm guessing that form allowed them to check with Raleigh or whoever to see if I had been diagnosed with any mental issues or committed to a mental health institution. Just wondering how does that aspect get checked now ?
 
Glock5857 said:
Just wondering, everytime I bought PPP's I would have to go to the sheriff's dept. And sign a Mental Records Release Form. I'm guessing that form allowed them to check with Raleigh or whoever to see if I had been diagnosed with any mental issues or committed to a mental health institution. Just wondering how does that aspect get checked now ?
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Same way it does for buying a long gun or other firearm. Buying a pistol/handgun is now treated the same way.
 
I heard there was a thread about Chapel Hill going on?

iu

Birthplace of Ruger Firearms
 
@Joel ... all ridicule and hostility aside for the moment..... the root of this issue is the relative amount of TRUST one places in which group. If you think that LEO are, as a class, mostly good guys who really want to protect us, then cooperating with them certainly is, as you say -"reasonable."
There is a large and growing number of us who not only do not share that premise,but find it ridiculous and profoundly UNreasonable, given the track record. The risk that some bad people in the private citizenry may access guns (this is not debatable... it will happen) is negligible compared to ceding more "cooperation" to some of the most evil and dishonest people who frankly HATE your ability to have firearms and threaten their hegemony.

That is the core of the issue here.
 
willpgn said:
If one or the other should be added on top of a bill of sale…or be left plain to get the full BOS flavor! 🤔
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Since nothing can be done to improve the flavor of a BOS, I say leave it plain. Now if we are talking about lemon bars, Italian meringue is the way to go.
 
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