July 2016 rule change

[Slosolo2]

I missed my deadline to establish a trust before the rule change and pretty much gave up on NFA since the former York Co. Sheriff was on record as refusing to sign NFA docs.
We've got a new sheriff so I thought I'd look into it again.
Reading what Big Waylon posted I had a question about this section:

- requiring that a copy of all applications to make or transfer a firearm, and the specified form for responsible persons (5320.23), be forwarded to the chief law enforcement officer (CLEO) of the locality in which the applicant/transferee or responsible person resides; and
- eliminating the requirement for certification signed by the CLEO.

Does this mean NFA forms are now like the C&R application where your CLEO is notified but doesn't have input in the process?

 

[backwoodsshooter]

Slosolo2 yes you CLEO is not required to sign off. Just have to notify them. Plus submit a photo ID and finger prints when sending in Form ( insert whatever form you are going to use.) I still put all my stuff in to a trust just in case anything happens to me

 

[Zbizzle911]

You know the deffinition of CLEO is pretty broad. The chief law enforcement officer is the local chief of police, county sheriff, head of the State police, State or local district attorney or prosecutor. So now lets say you don't really want your sheriff knowing you've got one? Why not just notify one of these other people who are in the ATF's definition of CLEO? I recently bought a new can and my notification went to the head of the NCSHP so I'm sure you could do the head of SLED or hell the DA in your area if you wanted !

 

[Slosolo2]

Slosolo2 yes you CLEO is not required to sign off. Just have to notify them. Plus submit a photo ID and finger prints when sending in Form ( insert whatever form you are going to use.) I still put all my stuff in to a trust just in case anything happens to me

Thanks, that could be a very expensive change to the rule for me.

 

[Slosolo2]

You know the deffinition of CLEO is pretty broad. The chief law enforcement officer is the local chief of police, county sheriff, head of the State police, State or local district attorney or prosecutor. So now lets say you don't really want your sheriff knowing you've got one? Why not just notify one of these other people who are in the ATF's definition of CLEO? I recently bought a new can and my notification went to the head of the NCSHP so I'm sure you could do the head of SLED or hell the DA in your area if you wanted !

It happens that I kind of know the county solicitor (SC for DA) but I don't really care if the sheriff knows or not as long as he can't squash the application.

 

[22Rimfire]

Not trying to hijack OP. Did I miss something this past year? No more opening trusts for class three items? Haven't been active in the gun world so.much these past few years.

 

[Zbizzle911]

Not trying to hijack OP. Did I miss something this past year? No more opening trusts for class three items? Haven't been active in the gun world so.much these past few years.

41F removed the CLEO sign off now it's only a CLEO notification but it also made it to where you have to get finger prints and pictures for all on the trust if you go that route.

 

[Slosolo2]

Not trying to hijack OP. Did I miss something this past year? No more opening trusts for class three items? Haven't been active in the gun world so.much these past few years.

Yes there were some changes. The basics were that trustees had to be background checked just like you would if you submitted the form as an individual. Trust is still viable and offers advantages to individual forms with respect to estate planning. I assume a trust can still be written with assignment sheets but maybe not.

Here is the detailed link
https://www.carolinafirearmsforum.com/forum/nfa-stamp-collecting/684-guide-to-nfa-forms#post684

 

[Slosolo2]

41F removed the CLEO sign off now it's only a CLEO notification but it also made it to where you have to get finger prints and pictures for all on the trust if you go that route.

So no more assignments to legally allow a buddy to shoot your toy at the range without prior prints etc?

 

[Zbizzle911]

41F removed the CLEO sign off now it's only a CLEO notification but it also made it to where you have to get finger prints and pictures for all on the trust if you go that route.

So no more assignments to legally allow a buddy to shoot your toy at the range without prior prints etc?

Pretty much

 

[Slosolo2]

That sucks more than not being able to reply to a reply

 

[22Rimfire]

Yes there were some changes. The basics were that trustees had to be background checked just like you would if you submitted the form as an individual. Trust is still viable and offers advantages to individual forms with respect to estate planning. I assume a trust can still be written with assignment sheets but maybe not.

Here is the detailed link
https://www.carolinafirearmsforum.com/forum/nfa-stamp-collecting/684-guide-to-nfa-forms#post684

​​​​​​thank you Slosolo2 and Zbizzle911. Just another step but at least it's still an option.

 

[Zbizzle911]

​​​​​​thank you Slosolo2 and Zbizzle911. Just another step but at least it's still an option.

Your welcome!

 

[BigWaylon]

So no more assignments to legally allow a buddy to shoot your toy at the range without prior prints etc?

Explain this question a bit more.

Because theres nothing stopping anybody from added a trustee after an item was approved, without having to do prints & photos. And if you remove them before submitting the next form, still no prints or photos.

Or, just create a new trust for each item with just you in it, then add others after form is approved.

Or start a new one every couple years using the same procedure, and get approvals in batches.

There's no proactive notification required if there's a change in RPs after approval. It only matters who is an RP when you submit a new form.

 

[bigfelipe]

Explain this question a bit more.

Because theres nothing stopping anybody from added a trustee after an item was approved, without having to do prints & photos. And if you remove them before submitting the next form, still no prints or photos.

Or, just create a new trust for each item with just you in it, then add others after form is approved.

Or start a new one every couple years using the same procedure, and get approvals in batches.

There's no proactive notification required if there's a change in RPs after approval. It only matters who is an RP when you submit a new form.

Exactly... And that's why the whole thing is stupid and pointless and should be done away with... Dumb ass bureaucrats...

 

[Slosolo2]

Explain this question a bit more.

Because theres nothing stopping anybody from added a trustee after an item was approved, without having to do prints & photos. And if you remove them before submitting the next form, still no prints or photos.

Or, just create a new trust for each item with just you in it, then add others after form is approved.

Or start a new one every couple years using the same procedure, and get approvals in batches.

There's no proactive notification required if there's a change in RPs after approval. It only matters who is an RP when you submit a new form.

Thanks. I never thought about how to navigate the system beyond the obvious. I'm at elementary level, this is advanced NFA theory.

Big Felipe is right it's a ridiculous system but I don't think it will change anytime soon.

 

[JohnFreeman]

41F removed the CLEO sign off now it's only a CLEO notification but it also made it to where you have to get finger prints and pictures for all on the trust if you go that route.

So no more assignments to legally allow a buddy to shoot your toy at the range without prior prints etc?

A buddy has always been able to shoot your NFA toys at the range without prior prints...

 

[Wahoo95]

41F removed the CLEO sign off now it's only a CLEO notification but it also made it to where you have to get finger prints and pictures for all on the trust if you go that route.

So no more assignments to legally allow a buddy to shoot your toy at the range without prior prints etc?

To be clear, no prints are required of anyone that you allow to shoot your toys at the range.