L
Lawless
Guest
You better, it will be on the test.
http://gatesofvienna.net/2017/03/antifa-in-the-usa-thuggery-iconography-and-merchandise/
http://gatesofvienna.net/2017/03/antifa-in-the-usa-thuggery-iconography-and-merchandise/
OP
Lawless
Guest
9outof10mms
Enginerding, good coffee, and factual opinions.
2A Bourbon Hound 2024
Supporting Member
Multi-Factor Enabled
I can't keep track of all these platforms and allegiances. Should I be worried about these numb nuts or no? Other than them having a striking semblance to an ISIS pajama party, I'm pretty sure 9mm has enough penetrating power to go through a flag and a bandana with a face as a backstop. Not much worried about that.
Merchandising, merchandising, where the real money from the movement is made. We put the movement's name on everything. antifa-the T-shirt, antifa-the Coloring Book,antifa -the Lunch box, antifa-the Breakfast Cereal,antifa -the Flame Thrower. The anarchists really love this one.
Brilliant.
I wouldn't get in a frenzy or anything, but they are well funded, well organized, and there are discussions on their web sites about buying weapons and training. Seems like it could evolve into a bit of a problem.
God willing, we’ll all meet again in Antifa 2: The Search for More Money.
I'd say that "evolution" has already happened.
Parts of it yes. It can get a LOT worse.
georgel
Behind Every Blade of Grass
Charter Member
Benefactor
Supporting Member
Multi-Factor Enabled
Never underestimate the danger of someone that that has committed their life to an ideology. A True Believer is no longer constrained by morals or logic. Most aren't coming up with these ideas themselves, but being lead by others. That's the real danger.
The same has likely been said of us pro-2nd Amendment folks for quite some time.
Man, these people make my head hurt. You are going to combine the symbols of anarchy and communism? Revolt against all rules, there are no rules; rally under the state flag to do it though. Or we crack your skull. At least have the decency to admit you want to overthrow capitalism and replace it with communism, not some sort of anarchists free for all. Obviously the "power to the people" folks want to remove the power FROM the people and give it all to the "dear leader", as long as it's "their dear leader." You know, because free stuff.
Well SOMEONE has to maintain the fairness of the anarchy... and in order to do that they need complete control.
Teacher
Well-Known Member
Antifa douchebags are easy to spot. They're the beanpole guys dressed in all black, skinny jeans & masks & they're women are the fat cows with their faces covered screaming about how this is their country & how Trump supporters are fascist Nazis.
Well SOMEONE has to maintain the fairness of the anarchy... and in order to do that they need complete control.
This is what perfect sarcasm looks like. Kudos to you. I like it. lmao
Teacher
Well-Known Member
Any of you guys seen these communist scumbags in person? I have & I'll tell you that they're dedicated to their ideology & they don't hesitate to attack people they disagree with. I had a little altercation late last year in Charlotte over the "Grab Life By The P*ssy" patch on my vest. lol!
I think in most of the areas they are currently operating, if they attack first they win because so few people will fight back.
They try this in the wrong areas of the country and it might not work out like that. And take note that they did not try the guy in the UC Berkley vid that looked 6"4" and wearing the jacket with all the pins. They stayed away from that guy but jumped a fat guy, and old guy, and a skinny guy, and blindsided a few others. When he came in they backed up.
Anyone dedicated to their ideology, that does not inherently dis avow violence, tends to become very Machiavellian towards the use of violence.
Teacher
Well-Known Member
You are 100% correct my friend. They are cowards. They prey on the weak & when someone stands up to them they run & hide like the roaches they are.
I was unfortunate to be in Seattle years ago when they held the World Bank meetings and the little bastards tore up the town. I was in the burbs so I didn't get involved in anything crazy, but the little sh*tbags did cost me a chance for an all expense paid dinner at one of my favorite high end steak houses. As things turned out there was a bunch of them at my gate at Seatac when I was flying out. They were all comparing itineraries, and where the next protest they were booked for was occurring. These creeps have some money and organization behind them. Even without firearms that makes them dangerous. Our new President and his Justice Dept should track down their funding and organization and if any of it is foreign they should go after them as a terrorist organization. Even if they are US based they probably could use a little watching if they are committing acts of violence and vandalism.
Teacher
Well-Known Member
It's a well known fact that George Soros is funding them. Hungarian born Jew who worked for the Nazis during WWII posing as a Christian.
I know that, but my guess is legally there should probably be an investigation before President Trump drone strikes that MFer. If drone strikes were fine for Obama to use on US citizens, then it should be easy to justify on that piece of excrement.
Teacher
Well-Known Member
I agree 100%
OP
Lawless
Guest
What we all need to understand here is how it affects you, today, tomorrow or whenever on the ground. Avoid such altercations and crowds if at all possible. If not and you find yourself knee deep in screaming cows and skinny jeans then you have some fast decisions to make. Your best bet is to quickly get the fark out of there. If that is not possible, fighting should be your last resort. 20 skinny jeans wearing mama's boys are still easily able to mess up your evening in a big way. If you shoot one, sure the rest will run, but where does that leave you?
I can tell you, it leaves you financially ruined probably. Even if you are exonerated it will cost you everything if it goes to trial.
Of course this is all theoretical and we are in the beginning stages of unrest. I have told a few folks that I believe when things warm up weather wise we will see some heavy rioting in some of the northern hotspots. Once things get kinetically crazy the chances of being made into a courtroom pinata are less and eventually if it goes the way it has in some parts of the world you will just do what you must and then go home like it never happened.
As to the people themselves, do not underestimate their resolve and willingness to do harm. In their minds, it's all justified.
I can tell you, it leaves you financially ruined probably. Even if you are exonerated it will cost you everything if it goes to trial.
Of course this is all theoretical and we are in the beginning stages of unrest. I have told a few folks that I believe when things warm up weather wise we will see some heavy rioting in some of the northern hotspots. Once things get kinetically crazy the chances of being made into a courtroom pinata are less and eventually if it goes the way it has in some parts of the world you will just do what you must and then go home like it never happened.
As to the people themselves, do not underestimate their resolve and willingness to do harm. In their minds, it's all justified.
OP
Lawless
Guest
Saw this at WRSA
1) If you’re engaging in street theater in the first place, you’re already doing it wrong.
Things get changed in your congressman’s and councilman’s office, at his fundraising office, and at the polling booth.
Money and influence talks, bullshit walks (at a street protest).
2) List everything in history changed by mob street protest. I’ll wait while you comb the world for even one example.
In case that left a mark
3) That said, if you’re bound and determined to go full retard,
this is how it’s done, from the bottom up:
boots
shin guards under pants (ideally, not visible, but there, either way)
knee protection
hip and tailbone pads
hard cup
ideally, level II or better bullet-resistant vest
and HDPE Level III hard plates (20 pounds lighter than AR500 steel, and rifle proof)
failing the bulletproof model, padded hard plastic chest armor:
football or hockey stuff, and/or a moto riders back turtle plate
sealed swim goggles (eye pro, and gas/vapor/acid protection)
ear plugs (boat horns and whistles work both ways, kids)
shoulder, elbow, and forearm pads
hard-backed gloves
an under-hoodie shell helmet (MICH, biker minimal, or homebrew cut down batting helmet, whatever)
respirator with N100 filtration for riot gasses, in pocket/pouch
Skip bandanas/balaclavas.
If you’re worried about ID, you can defeat facial recognition with a much lower profile by cutting down a latex Halloween mask in flesh tones. An old man/woman mask with bigger eye holes and open mouth will do fine, and it’s a lot harder to spot from distance,in a crowd. so you won’t look like a hooligan from 50 yards to TPTB.
Neutral earthtone outer colors is the way to go.
Brighter colors for your under layer, in case you have to flee, changes your appearance rapidly.
If you’re Virgil Cole from Flight Of The Intruder, make/buy your outer pants and jacket/hoodie extra baggy, cut the outer seams, and Velcro them together, for a quick-change. You can make the inside a bright color for quick removal/reversal if you think you need to become Houdini.
And seriously consider nomex underwear if you think getting lit on fire is a thing, and you like your skin.
Sticks and shields are rightly regarded as weapons by any cops in overwatch with two brain cells (which is not all of them).
Carrying them is an invitation to hassle, confiscation, spray/taze/assault beatdown, and arrest. Potentially all four for the same low price.
Padded and protected body parts are not.
Knives, brass knuckles, etc. are dumb. See above.
You might can get away with a flag/banner on a piece of light black pipe steel. Esp. if you paint it white, and stencil on Schedule 40 markings to make it look like plastic. Just saying.
OC spray, (esp. Bear Spray canisters, which has a 10 yard reach out and f*** someone up range), and stun guns, OTOH, are – in most states – not so regarded. IANAL: check you state/city laws, and if legal, load up.
Ditto for CCW: if you can carry, carry. If not, don’t.
If you carry, have an attorney on speed dial and retainer. (Probably a good idea anyways for any event.)
If anything goes down, for the 10,000th time:
Do. Not. Talk. To. Cops. Ever.
They are not your friends, and if they’d been doing their job, nothing would have happened in the first place.
Check with your lawyer, but all they are entitled to is your name.
Not 57 other details.
If you aren’t driving a car, they have no right to demand ID.
(This is why you probably shouldn’t be carrying it in the first place, because if you don’t have it – or a wallet, cellphone, etc. – they can’t search it, legally or illegally.)
Don’t lie to them: give them your real name, and nothing else, other than “I refuse to answer further questions without an attorney present, and I’m exercising my right to remain silent at this point.” Then STFU.
Unless you want to press for “Am I being detained? May I leave?”
That’s your Geneva Convention legal briefing.
You should also have designated medics, with a daypack full of first aid gear, including bottles of water for riot spray decon, and full TCCC supplies.
You should also have designated firefighters, with the biggest small portable CO2 and dry chem extinguishers they can carry concealed in packs or on bodies. Incendiary injuries aren’t funny if aimed at you, but blowing them out by surprise always is.
People should be in groups, with a responsible leader.
Who should be on walkie via earpeice for tactical command and intel updates.
Security, medical, and fire fighters should be within arm reach of that leader, within each small group, and responsible to that designated leader.
It should go without saying that there should be P-A-C-E comm plans.
Consider burner phones for event texting, sterilized of any outside numbers or convos – just for use on the day, in case confiscated/stolen/dropped.
Everyone should know P-A-C-E egress plans, rally points, and a safe person to contact for pickup if/when things go to shit.
Including a friend for pickup, an/the attorney, and a bail agent.
Everyone should have a map to the two closest ERs.
It’s also highly recommended that a couple of infiltrators be salted on the other side or as bystanders, charged only with hanging out and listening, plus passing on any hints of impending violence. Someone or three near the cops, and any tactical command post for same, would also be a damn good idea. Both should have the same level of contingency plans – if not more – if caught, bumped, or need to flee.
And you should also hive high point eyes-on surveillance overwatch in as many places as possible, along with a Culper-certified ACE nearby but secure, to battletrack the entire event, on police/fire/EMS and news scanners and local broadcast media, in real time. And forward updates to you on the command net, or text.
(Be aware that every TV and radio station has a back channel broadcast line to communicate with HQ, which is as good or better than the police nets, and you should be listening to that as well. Someone – maybe homeless looking – hanging around the broadcast vans to listen, and with both a walkie and a text/cell burner phone isn’t a bad idea either.)
Can’t pull off that level of prep?
Sucks to be you.
You aren’t tall enough for this ride, and as suggested from the outset, you should probably have stayed home to begin with.
Ignore this at your peril.
Quite possibly in a Darwin Award-winning sort of way.
1* isn’t just for the Blue Crew, boys and girls.
1) If you’re engaging in street theater in the first place, you’re already doing it wrong.
Things get changed in your congressman’s and councilman’s office, at his fundraising office, and at the polling booth.
Money and influence talks, bullshit walks (at a street protest).
2) List everything in history changed by mob street protest. I’ll wait while you comb the world for even one example.
In case that left a mark
3) That said, if you’re bound and determined to go full retard,
this is how it’s done, from the bottom up:
boots
shin guards under pants (ideally, not visible, but there, either way)
knee protection
hip and tailbone pads
hard cup
ideally, level II or better bullet-resistant vest
and HDPE Level III hard plates (20 pounds lighter than AR500 steel, and rifle proof)
failing the bulletproof model, padded hard plastic chest armor:
football or hockey stuff, and/or a moto riders back turtle plate
sealed swim goggles (eye pro, and gas/vapor/acid protection)
ear plugs (boat horns and whistles work both ways, kids)
shoulder, elbow, and forearm pads
hard-backed gloves
an under-hoodie shell helmet (MICH, biker minimal, or homebrew cut down batting helmet, whatever)
respirator with N100 filtration for riot gasses, in pocket/pouch
Skip bandanas/balaclavas.
If you’re worried about ID, you can defeat facial recognition with a much lower profile by cutting down a latex Halloween mask in flesh tones. An old man/woman mask with bigger eye holes and open mouth will do fine, and it’s a lot harder to spot from distance,in a crowd. so you won’t look like a hooligan from 50 yards to TPTB.
Neutral earthtone outer colors is the way to go.
Brighter colors for your under layer, in case you have to flee, changes your appearance rapidly.
If you’re Virgil Cole from Flight Of The Intruder, make/buy your outer pants and jacket/hoodie extra baggy, cut the outer seams, and Velcro them together, for a quick-change. You can make the inside a bright color for quick removal/reversal if you think you need to become Houdini.
And seriously consider nomex underwear if you think getting lit on fire is a thing, and you like your skin.
Sticks and shields are rightly regarded as weapons by any cops in overwatch with two brain cells (which is not all of them).
Carrying them is an invitation to hassle, confiscation, spray/taze/assault beatdown, and arrest. Potentially all four for the same low price.
Padded and protected body parts are not.
Knives, brass knuckles, etc. are dumb. See above.
You might can get away with a flag/banner on a piece of light black pipe steel. Esp. if you paint it white, and stencil on Schedule 40 markings to make it look like plastic. Just saying.
OC spray, (esp. Bear Spray canisters, which has a 10 yard reach out and f*** someone up range), and stun guns, OTOH, are – in most states – not so regarded. IANAL: check you state/city laws, and if legal, load up.
Ditto for CCW: if you can carry, carry. If not, don’t.
If you carry, have an attorney on speed dial and retainer. (Probably a good idea anyways for any event.)
If anything goes down, for the 10,000th time:
Do. Not. Talk. To. Cops. Ever.
They are not your friends, and if they’d been doing their job, nothing would have happened in the first place.
Check with your lawyer, but all they are entitled to is your name.
Not 57 other details.
If you aren’t driving a car, they have no right to demand ID.
(This is why you probably shouldn’t be carrying it in the first place, because if you don’t have it – or a wallet, cellphone, etc. – they can’t search it, legally or illegally.)
Don’t lie to them: give them your real name, and nothing else, other than “I refuse to answer further questions without an attorney present, and I’m exercising my right to remain silent at this point.” Then STFU.
Unless you want to press for “Am I being detained? May I leave?”
That’s your Geneva Convention legal briefing.
You should also have designated medics, with a daypack full of first aid gear, including bottles of water for riot spray decon, and full TCCC supplies.
You should also have designated firefighters, with the biggest small portable CO2 and dry chem extinguishers they can carry concealed in packs or on bodies. Incendiary injuries aren’t funny if aimed at you, but blowing them out by surprise always is.
People should be in groups, with a responsible leader.
Who should be on walkie via earpeice for tactical command and intel updates.
Security, medical, and fire fighters should be within arm reach of that leader, within each small group, and responsible to that designated leader.
It should go without saying that there should be P-A-C-E comm plans.
Consider burner phones for event texting, sterilized of any outside numbers or convos – just for use on the day, in case confiscated/stolen/dropped.
Everyone should know P-A-C-E egress plans, rally points, and a safe person to contact for pickup if/when things go to shit.
Including a friend for pickup, an/the attorney, and a bail agent.
Everyone should have a map to the two closest ERs.
It’s also highly recommended that a couple of infiltrators be salted on the other side or as bystanders, charged only with hanging out and listening, plus passing on any hints of impending violence. Someone or three near the cops, and any tactical command post for same, would also be a damn good idea. Both should have the same level of contingency plans – if not more – if caught, bumped, or need to flee.
And you should also hive high point eyes-on surveillance overwatch in as many places as possible, along with a Culper-certified ACE nearby but secure, to battletrack the entire event, on police/fire/EMS and news scanners and local broadcast media, in real time. And forward updates to you on the command net, or text.
(Be aware that every TV and radio station has a back channel broadcast line to communicate with HQ, which is as good or better than the police nets, and you should be listening to that as well. Someone – maybe homeless looking – hanging around the broadcast vans to listen, and with both a walkie and a text/cell burner phone isn’t a bad idea either.)
Can’t pull off that level of prep?
Sucks to be you.
You aren’t tall enough for this ride, and as suggested from the outset, you should probably have stayed home to begin with.
Ignore this at your peril.
Quite possibly in a Darwin Award-winning sort of way.
1* isn’t just for the Blue Crew, boys and girls.
OP
Lawless
Guest
Im not familiar with this Based Stick Man story - the guy to his left/our right - with him or one of the ANTIFA folks? What about the others (that he's not swinging at)?
Just trying to find out what is going on exactly.
Also, dont assume someone that has particular logos is part of this crew - the RVA band "Strike Anywhere" has been using the 3 Arrows logo for quite a while etc
Churchill said something to the effect of: "the fascists of the future will call themselves anti fascists"
Churchill certainly wasn't perfect, but he was a pretty smart guy most of the time. If Patton and Churchhill had their way they would have neutered Russia, and saved us a whole bunch of crap in the last 75 years. Or maybe caused more crap. Who really knows? But I liked their reasoning.
Speaking of Antifa:
And a few select comments from that thread:
The other point of view is, they are already willing to do violence, while we are still willing to let the law handle it. We may already be in a dirty civil war, where the aggressors are organized, mobilized, and arming up.
https://mountainguerrilla.wordpress.com/.../skull.../
I think the issue is that we understand what escalating it means. Deep down we, our side that is. Recognizes that there is no going back and realizes exactly how far we will have to go.
Our refusing, so far, to fight is not a result of cowardice or a lack of ability but rather the decisions that we can't let ourselves go there for "light and transient reasons," as our founders put it.
What they don't understand is that everything they've done is only by our allowance. People are getting fed up because we recognize that they are pushing the envelope of what's acceptable and we know given the opportunity they'll take it all the way.
Sometimes people don't sit there and take it because they're powerless. They do it because they recognize how powerful they are and would rather not have to really hurt others.
Note that none of these antifa events have happened in a CCW state. Because when they start bullying and harassing someone peacefully demonstrating for a political position they don't agree with in a CCW friendly state, at least one of them is going to get a set of surplus holes.
They've proven they will attack and form a stomp circle. That right there is threat of death or serious bodily harm. And all the justification needed to defend yourself.
Those of you on FB should go to Brad's page and read the whole thing. We're not the only ones seeing what this could become.
Brad Torgersen
Yesterday at 12:24pm ·
Repeating a thought from a different thread: Antifa has read and understands Alinsky's Rules For Radicals, very well.Their sole objective is to antagonize their opponents into a violent overreaction, so that Antifa can play-act the victim, while pointing to the criminal hypocrisy of the other side.
The rules become an umbrella beneath which Antifa will happily hide.
What Antifa does not understand―because none of them have ever lived in countries which are not kept internally safe, to the degree the U.S. is kept internally safe―is that you don't want to force polite folk into a no-win scenario.
If you make a polite man think he's been forced into a corner―from which the only escape route, is through YOU the antagonist―you will shortly find yourself made into a greasy stain on the pavement.
Law and order be damned. (emphasis mine)
So, the moral is: tempt fate at your peril, Antifa kids.
It's all fun and games until somebody sends you to the morgue.
Yesterday at 12:24pm ·
Repeating a thought from a different thread: Antifa has read and understands Alinsky's Rules For Radicals, very well.Their sole objective is to antagonize their opponents into a violent overreaction, so that Antifa can play-act the victim, while pointing to the criminal hypocrisy of the other side.
The rules become an umbrella beneath which Antifa will happily hide.
What Antifa does not understand―because none of them have ever lived in countries which are not kept internally safe, to the degree the U.S. is kept internally safe―is that you don't want to force polite folk into a no-win scenario.
If you make a polite man think he's been forced into a corner―from which the only escape route, is through YOU the antagonist―you will shortly find yourself made into a greasy stain on the pavement.
Law and order be damned. (emphasis mine)
So, the moral is: tempt fate at your peril, Antifa kids.
It's all fun and games until somebody sends you to the morgue.
And a few select comments from that thread:
What people such as Antifa don't comprehend is the old military dictum of "the Golden Bridge." You allow a hard-pressed enemy some means of exit or honorable retreat, because if you don't, you put their backs up against a wall and then they'll fight back like the devil, and there's no telling what might happen then..
Well, they're placing average people into that exact situation. A no win situation. I don't think they quite comprehend what that might lead to.
Well, they're placing average people into that exact situation. A no win situation. I don't think they quite comprehend what that might lead to.
Agreed 100% This is also why chivalry allowed many, many opportunities for a man to peacefully settle a dispute; without sacrificing the dignity of either party. If it actually got to swords or pistols, one or both sides had stubbornly refused to seek an alternative.
The other point of view is, they are already willing to do violence, while we are still willing to let the law handle it. We may already be in a dirty civil war, where the aggressors are organized, mobilized, and arming up.
https://mountainguerrilla.wordpress.com/.../skull.../
I think the issue is that we understand what escalating it means. Deep down we, our side that is. Recognizes that there is no going back and realizes exactly how far we will have to go.
Our refusing, so far, to fight is not a result of cowardice or a lack of ability but rather the decisions that we can't let ourselves go there for "light and transient reasons," as our founders put it.
What they don't understand is that everything they've done is only by our allowance. People are getting fed up because we recognize that they are pushing the envelope of what's acceptable and we know given the opportunity they'll take it all the way.
Sometimes people don't sit there and take it because they're powerless. They do it because they recognize how powerful they are and would rather not have to really hurt others.
Note that none of these antifa events have happened in a CCW state. Because when they start bullying and harassing someone peacefully demonstrating for a political position they don't agree with in a CCW friendly state, at least one of them is going to get a set of surplus holes.
They've proven they will attack and form a stomp circle. That right there is threat of death or serious bodily harm. And all the justification needed to defend yourself.
Antifa and Jihadis share that - they always go after the defenseless and unarmed. In both cases, when they *do* go after those well-equipped to fight back, they lose, hard.
Those of you on FB should go to Brad's page and read the whole thing. We're not the only ones seeing what this could become.
Teacher
Well-Known Member
You know guys... I have a dog in this fight. My grandfather was murdered in Korea by communists. I never got to meet him. My father was wounded by communists in Vietnam. Last year I was hit in the face with a glass bottle by Antifa communists. I'm a Christian man & I don't condone violence, but even Lord Jesus got violent when the heathens were defiling the Temple of God. This country was dedicated to God Almighty by our forefathers. No matter what Obama said, this country belongs to God.
I for one will stand & fight against this tyranny. I'm not scared of going to jail or even dying. There are things in this world that are worth dying for. My family, my friends & my brothers in arms. When the weather gets warm & the heathen rage & the people imagine a vain thing... I'll be there.
I know some of you guys will be by my side. This country belongs to us. It shelters our families. Our families have bled & died for what we have & we will not sit idly by & let some communist scumbags threaten our existence.
Laws be damned. I'm all in.
I for one will stand & fight against this tyranny. I'm not scared of going to jail or even dying. There are things in this world that are worth dying for. My family, my friends & my brothers in arms. When the weather gets warm & the heathen rage & the people imagine a vain thing... I'll be there.
I know some of you guys will be by my side. This country belongs to us. It shelters our families. Our families have bled & died for what we have & we will not sit idly by & let some communist scumbags threaten our existence.
Laws be damned. I'm all in.
They're also hiding behind the system they're supposedly taking down. They get to whack people weaker then them or those who can't strike back (cops) and do so in places they already control (liberal cities). They'll keep their trouble there and sell advertising eyeball viewers to the media, but otherwise won't have any actual impact on society at large.
Try that crap in the outside world and I doubt it will go their way. I don't know all that many people but I can think of 2 right off the top of my head who spent time risking their lives killing bad guys on the other side of the world. Can't imagine they wouldn't snap and start killing here closer to home should the need arise.