medicaid look-back period

[GeorgeBush]

I never cease to be amazed with the wisdom the older guys on this forum have, well, older than me at least (usually). I have a family member who is getting royally screwed on this in my opinion and I was wondering if you all had any tips.

Basically my grandma lived beside my aunt for years and my aunt took care of her so she wouldnt have to go into a resthome. Later they sold the house and she moved in with my aunt, care continued, but then she had a stroke. Went to the hospital for awhile, went to resthome, then went to hospice.

Medicaid refuses to pay for resthome and hospice because of look-back period where she sold the house. I understand it exists for the purpose of fraud... but come on... that isnt what happened at all. Her house sold above market value and my aunt was her caretaker for so long... seems like my limited Google research says thats enough but clearly it isnt.

Any tips or avenues I should pursue? Let me know if you guys require additional information, the situation is pretty dire, something like 8000 dollars a month (cash).

 

[noway2]

Sorry you ran into this. I’m not sure if there is an after the fact solution. I would recommend talking to a good, experienced estate attorney.

From being involved in family estate planning, I do know that if one requires in facility care that Medicaid will pick it up and then try to recoup it via the estate. The problem is in property (real estate) becoming part of ones estate and hence subject to Medicaid claw back. The fact that a relative took them in, etc, s immaterial even if it is (morally or factually) correct. What you’re dealing with is the letter of the law and a bureaucracy.

The way to avoid this type of situation is to make property joint tenancy with survivorship with the other party such that upon their death the property never even touches or becomes part of the estate and hence is immune from being claimed against.

Similarly, there are these things called Medicaid trusts that you can quickly (days to weeks) liquidate assets into to prevent claim by Medicaid. You will take a hit, but it’s nowhere near what the system will claim after the fact. Again, it may be too late. Talk to an attorney.

 

[Jim1392]

I can tell you from experience that you will not be able to get around the look back period. If I remember correctly it was 5 years back when we had to deal with it. We learned this the hard way with my wife's grandmother. After Medicaid taking all her Grandmother's life savings and the proceeds of her house for payments due. My wife was supposed to get the house and her savings according to her will. After that we spoke to an attorney and placed my wife's fathers house in our names with a life occupancy clause so her father would never have to worry about leaving. Of course we did this while he was in fairly good health. When he passed ten years later the house was ours and there was no probate as far as the house was concerned. We are now talking about doing the same for our house with our son since we have no intention of leaving until they carry us out of here.

 

[rdinatal]

Two words: Family Trust

@GeorgeBush, sorry for what you've going through.

 

[GymB]

I assume that your grandmother has passed. Why not just ignore the bills from the rest home and hospice, let them come after the estate?

 

[noway2]

Two words: Family Trust

A trust, especially a revocable one, won't fully protect you. As our attorney put it, a trust covers the front end, but you've got a back end problem. You need to keep property from even touching their estate.

 

[rdinatal]

A trust, especially a revocable one, won't fully protect you. As our attorney put it, a trust covers the front end, but you've got a back end problem. You need to keep property from even touching their estate.

True, you need to do this before the 'look back' window. We were thinking long term, 15years, so assisted living can't touch the house, bank accounts, retirement.

 

[cubrock]

You need an attorney skilled in this area.

 

[rdinatal]

You need an attorney skilled in this area.

At this point, yes.

 

[Grim]

I believe the lookback period is 5 years.

 

[rdinatal]

I believe the lookback period is 5 years.

Shhh... 🤫

 

[Howland]

An estate attorney will be the most reliable source of information and advice around your options.

The look back used to be five years unless assets went into a trust which made it ten years. This is several years out of date so consultant an attorney. Medicaid is not an inheritance protection program. It is a welfare program for the indigent. Medicaid doesn't generally pay until assets are depleted.

 

[noway2]

Medicaid is not an inheritance protection program. It is a welfare program for the indigent. Medicaid doesn't generally pay until assets are depleted.

If I recall what our attorney said, this is correct. There are two types of care assistance, in home care and in facility care. Most people make too much money to qualify for in home care assistance. I know, it is backwards as in home care would be cheaper than in a facility, but congress hasn't caught up with the times. If you need to go into a facility, yes they will require you to deplete your assets first. A spouse can keep the house, but it will be claimed from their estate and putting the house in a trust does not protect it from this, which is where the joint tenancy with survivorship on the deed comes into play as it keeps the property from ever being part of the estate.