Rivian Truck

When I think of electric vehicles, I think of my cell phone that uses similar battery technology, on a smaller scale. The phone battery, which regularly recharged, suffers from performance degradation after several months to a year. I can't help but think the mileage availability is likewise going to go down, significantly, over time.
 
GoWolfpack said:
I tell you, I've been looking for a citation on this for a little while, and I haven't been able to find it. Trucks are classed by GVWR in every emission law I can find.
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What I read on the internet is that it’s tied to cafe goals for the manufacturer, something about interior volume and categories.
 
And dang if I didn't see one on my way to town to buy lunch.

Guess you guys talked it up.
 
phideux said:
I can do that in my Ford for about 450-500 miles before I have to worry about gas. How far will that thing run in those conditions??
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He definitely can’t match your mileage but it prob will cost him bout $8 to go those 500 miles. How much to fill up your truck? It’s a crazy expensive truck and I wouldn’t buy one (I do own an EV though) but it’s a cool concept for people with lots of money.
 
phideux said:
I can do that in my Ford for about 450-500 miles before I have to worry about gas. How far will that thing run in those conditions??
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Watched the vids.. but noticed something missing. Didn’t see it getting submerged in water or mud, which is at least half of the “off road” experience, IMO? Wonder if there would be any issues if the backend took one for the team at the boat ramp and went under water, like I see half the people do at the ramp?
 
Pop N Shots said:
Watched the vids.. but noticed something missing. Didn’t see it getting submerged in water or mud, which is at least half of the “off road” experience, IMO? Wonder if there would be any issues if the backend took one for the team at the boat ramp and went under water, like I see half the people do at the ramp?
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I believe they can and actually are better than ice vehicles driving through standing water. No air intakes or exhaust pipe. Now, I would also not go crazy deep in it either. It’s not a sub.
 
Saw three this past weekend at a soccer tournament. Guy working there made the comment that you have to take them to a certified dealer for maintenance and repairs and the closest one is in Atlanta.
 
I usually see at least one of whatever the "new hotness" is up in Highlands. So I've seen a few different Rivians. Interesting to say the least.


At the price point of a ford electric truck without any history of service. That's a solid nope on them.

Of course I'm super skeptical on fully electric right now anyway. I am a fan of the idea for sure. There are even obvious use cases for some people right now beyond the "it" factor.

I still want to find out how any full electric does here in the wnc mountains. I make a climb 3 times a day. How does that change "total" mileage on a charge? An electric motor under a load uses much more energy.

From my perspective in the building/construction world, 15 years ago battery operated stuff was convenient. Pretty cool tech, but if you were doing any work that put a load on your tools. You used the corded stuff. Here in the last 5 years or so. The tech has gotten good enough that unless it's a super long runtime or under a heavy load. Battery powered stuff is worth it, to not have to run miles of cords or drag a heavy/noisy generator out.

But even still there are clear limits.This is tiny, 10amp/hr max batteries. The tech for 7klb vehicles and their batteries is still well above a reasonable profit to cost ratio. Much less the infrastructure to handle such power demands.

.gov is claiming everything will be full electric in 7 years by decree. But grid blackouts because it was unusually cold or hot or some other event that overtaxed the system is a problem even today.

It will be really cool when full electric is a viable option for vehicles but we aren't nearly there yet. At best we are at "the VAST majority use horses, etc. for transportation, the ICE engine exists and has its purpose/fans but the everyday, average household can't afford the item and the infrastructure doesn't yet support such new tech"...
 
noway2 said:
When I think of electric vehicles, I think of my cell phone that uses similar battery technology, on a smaller scale. The phone battery, which regularly recharged, suffers from performance degradation after several months to a year. I can't help but think the mileage availability is likewise going to go down, significantly, over time.
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And what are we going to do with all these batteries down the line? Hope someone smart figures that one out.
 
I did some basic research on these a few years ago. Best I could find the mileage estimates don‘t take into account going up mountains, or towing and hauling heavy things. Maybe they’ve done more since I looked, but for a truck IMO those things are kind of important. Now if you just want to say you have a cool electric truck and buzz around town that might not matter.
 
Trevillian said:
It will be really cool when full electric is a viable option for vehicles but we aren't nearly there yet. At best we are at "the VAST majority use horses, etc. for transportation, the ICE engine exists and has its purpose/fans but the everyday, average household can't afford the item and the infrastructure doesn't yet support such new tech"..
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Remember, that just because it isn’t coming out the tailpipe, doesn’t mean it’s pollution free. You’re just pushing the emissions up stream to the power plant, which is at best 50% efficient (same as an engine).
 
noway2 said:
Remember, that just because it isn’t coming out the tailpipe, doesn’t mean it’s pollution free. You’re just pushing the emissions up stream to the power plant, which is at best 50% efficient (same as an engine).
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I'm fairly certain power plants have significantly higher efficiency than gas car engines.

Think about it. It can weigh as much as it needs to. It can use a steam turbine. It can run at a constant RPM. You can take steps to extract more of the heat energy from the fuel than you ever could in a gas car. There are alot fewer design constraints on that system versus one that has to be light and mobile.

The cost difference to fill up an electric versus gas car would not be less if they were the same efficiency.
 
alpharius said:
I'm fairly certain power plants have significantly higher efficiency than gas car engines.

Think about it. It can weigh as much as it needs to. It can use a steam turbine. It can run at a constant RPM. You can take steps to extract more of the heat energy from the fuel than you ever could in a gas car. There are alot fewer design constraints on that system versus one that has to be light and mobile.

The cost difference to fill up an electric versus gas car would not be less if they were the same efficiency.
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The Efficiency of Power Plants of Different Types

How efficient are our power plants? Fossil fuel powered power plants, nuclear plants and renewable power plants all convert energy to electricity with a loss. This article takes a brief look at the efficiency of power plants.
www.brighthubengineering.com www.brighthubengineering.com
 
How do i get that power downstream when im stuck on the road in a blizzard? Or do i sit there watching the juice drain till i freeze to death.
 
ronn47 said:

The Efficiency of Power Plants of Different Types

How efficient are our power plants? Fossil fuel powered power plants, nuclear plants and renewable power plants all convert energy to electricity with a loss. This article takes a brief look at the efficiency of power plants.
www.brighthubengineering.com www.brighthubengineering.com
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This is interesting but it does it compare the efficiency of a car engine vs power plant?

Im not seeing that.
 
alpharius said:
This is interesting but it does it compare the efficiency of a car engine vs power plant?
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Per the laws of thermodynamics a combustion engine will have a max efficiency of 50%. In reality it’s more likely around 40%, which as the article stated is about the same as a conventional fossil fuel power plant. Of course this assumes your not using heat recovery methods.
 
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noway2 said:
Not unless you are doing some form of cogeneration where you're also making secondary use of the steam.
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Not sure exactly what you are referring to. What is a "secondary use of steam"?

Efficient power plants use multiple turbines in series to capture as much energy as feasible from steam before it leaves the system.

Compare that to a car -- most cars being naturally aspirated -- yet the existance of devices like turbo/superchargers indicate that there is plently of energy left in car exhaust which is wasted. This isn't the only source of inefficiency in a gas car though.
 
noway2 said:
Per the laws of thermodynamics a combustion engine wI’ll have a max efficiency of 50%. In reality it’s more likely around 40%, which as the article stated is about the same as a conventional fossil fuel power plant.
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If that's true then how do you account for the vast difference in cost/mile between electric and gas cars?

The cost per mile can easily be 4:1, gas to electric.
 
alpharius said:
Not sure exactly what you are referring to. What is a "secondary use of steam"?
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There are several ways to make use of steam after it’s been through the turbine: for example steam heating, making hot water, equipment sterilization, steam absorption chillers, etc. These things improve the overall fuel to utilized energy output but don’t change the efficiency of a system component.

alpharius said:
If that's true then how do you account for the vast difference in cost/mile between electric and gas cars?

The cost per mile can easily be 4:1, gas to electric.
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In part, efficiency of scale. Why doesn't everyone run a generator to power their house? It’s far more efficient to have a large generating station and a distribution network. Same as with large district cooling systems being more cost effective than putting AC units on every building.

When it comes to EVs there are costs other than the fuel which make me wonder if they’re really cheaper. Some of these costs haven’t been fully realized yet, for example insurance costs because repairs on EVs can be astronomically higher. The cost of the cars themselves is often times double that of an ICE vehicle and how long before the battery wears down to where you‘re looking at repair bill in the 10s of thousands.
 
noway2 said:
In part, efficiency of scale. Why doesn't everyone run a generator to power their house? It’s far more efficient to have a large generating station and a distribution network. Same as with large district cooling systems being more cost effective than putting AC units on every building.
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You are sort of saying what I am saying here. If you could somehow transmit the energy to all the cars involved, it would be better to have one massive gas-powered engine of equal total HP than a bunch of small enginies in each car.

Still, I think power plants are more efficient than equivalent output gas engines. Or else why would you not see internal combustion power plants? They are almost all using steam systems. They are doing that for a reason. Only other reason I can think of is reliability.

noway2 said:
When it comes to EVs there are costs other than the fuel which make me wonder if they’re really cheaper. Some of these costs haven’t been fully realized yet, for example insurance costs because repairs on EVs can be astronomically higher. The cost of the cars themselves is often times double that of an ICE vehicle and how long before the battery wears down to where you‘re looking at repair bill in the 10s of thousands.
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Right. But I would argue this is all just scaling, like you were referring to eariler. Electric cars are expensive to buy and expensive to repair (are they?) because they aren't as common. As they become more common they should become cheaper. We'll also come to understand how to build them cheaper over time.

Anyway, Im not arguing the electric cars are cost effective. I buy gas cars.
 
Diablos said:
How do i get that power downstream when im stuck on the road in a blizzard? Or do i sit there watching the juice drain till i freeze to death.
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I believe a guy with an EV mustang tried this very thing. He started with a full battery and stayed in car with temp set at 75 degrees to see when juice would run out. after 12 hours he wasn’t even at 50% yet. So basically as with an ice car it just depends on how much juice/fuel you have when you start. One thing the EV has over ice is your ice vehicle still might be going but you may be dead cause you forgot to clear the tailpipe of snow.
 
Amps 13 said:
I believe a guy with an EV mustang tried this very thing. He started with a full battery and stayed in car with temp set at 75 degrees to see when juice would run out. after 12 hours he wasn’t even at 50% yet. So basically as with an ice car it just depends on how much juice/fuel you have when you start. One thing the EV has over ice is your ice vehicle still might be going but you may be dead cause you forgot to clear the tailpipe of snow.
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I guess that'd be a good start, last blizzard out here, cars were stuck on the highway for 2 days
 
At racetrack (VIR) this weekend, guy paddocked beside us towed his track car up with one. Said it tows great but not a super long range when towing

IMG_2332.jpeg
 
Pop N Shots said:
Anyone seen one of these actually towing something? Just curious as they seem to be more of a statement piece.

Interesting…

Non-weighted / non-towing range:
Range, Charging, and Battery Life
For 2023, the R1T is offered with three different battery packs. The Standard pack is said to be good for 270 miles per charge while the Large and Max battery packs boast driving ranges of up to 352 and 400 miles, respectively.
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From inside ev's website
Screenshot_20230624_123206_Chrome.jpg
 
Mr. Bggs said:
From inside ev's website
View attachment 635742
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Not too bad if you really think about it. Would it be the best choice if you’re pulling a camper cross country? No it wouldn’t but what about a small to medium sized boat? Plenty of power and how many people drive more than an hour to put their boat in the water? Very small amount I’m betting.
 
I think I saw a news snippet the other day where the CEO of Ford said, "The F-150 Lighting is a real truck for real work."
 
Towing presents a different problem when you consider charging. Some chargers don't have space to accommodate a trailer of any size. Can you imagine having to unhitch a trailer every time you need to charge on a trip somewhere 600+ miles away?
 
Timfoilhat said:
Towing presents a different problem when you consider charging. Some chargers don't have space to accommodate a trailer of any size. Can you imagine having to unhitch a trailer every time you need to charge on a trip somewhere 600+ miles away?
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I definitely wouldn’t buy one of these for serious towing, especially distances. Or for heavy loads.

However there aren’t all that many people who regularly tow with their pickup trucks. Edmunds says 75% of truck owners use it one time a year or less (never or almost never). If you do it regularly get the proper tool for the job for sure - a diesel IMO.

Also not many pickups of any size out there that also do 0-60 in 3 seconds
 
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