Sizing die expander sticks

Timfoilhat

Timfoilhat

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Set up new Hornady 7.5x55 swiss dies. I lube every case by hand with Imperial sizing wax and a bit of mica in the case mouth. The case slides into the die easy enough, pops the primer out, and on the removal stroke it sticks bad. It will ultimately pull through with way too much effort. We've reached the limit of my experience. I'm not sure if this is a die problem, a Hornady problem, or a brass problem.

I've heard that 7.5x55 brass likes to be anealed, some (random internet people) even say after the every firing. I'm wondering if that's the likely issue. My other dies are all Forster, RCBS or Redding... so I don't know if this is perhaps typical of Hornady...I doubt it...but the other cases on my different dies all move through like butter.

I did complete the set up of the seating die and everything's working as it should. There's good neck tension on the bullet as measured with my informal method of sticking the round in my inertia puller and giving the bench 30 whacks. It barely moved. The seating went exactly as I would expect it to go. No bulges or kinks in the brass. The finished product chambers and ejects effortlessly.

PPU brass

Thoughts?

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That’s A LOT of neck tension from the die. The neck is being over sized and the sizer button is pulling it back out, therefore you are really working those necks, which is why they are saying it needs to be annealed every firing. This seems plausible with what you are saying is happening. Bushing does would help with this by allowing you to control the neck tension and sizing the neck much less than it is being sized in your current die setup.
 
Maybe some brass with pretty thick necks? When the die reduces the OD, then the ID is pretty small to pull over the expander? Sometimes when this is the case, the brass length will grow.
 
John said:
Maybe some brass with pretty thick necks? When the die reduces the OD, then the ID is pretty small to pull over the expander? Sometimes when this is the case, the brass length will grow.
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One option here would be turning the necks down to make them thinner if you didn’t want to go the bushing die route.
 
Jimbob78 said:
That’s A LOT of neck tension from the die. The neck is being over sized and the sizer button is pulling it back out, therefore you are really working those necks, which is why they are saying it needs to be annealed every firing. This seems plausible with what you are saying is happening. Bushing does would help with this by allowing you to control the neck tension and sizing the neck much less than it is being sized in your current die setup.
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I see where you're going wit this advice, but there's some feedback I read on using a bushing die for this specific case that makes me wonder.

"Neck sizing? Forget it. After very few times fired your case won't be chambering anyway. Even if you do neck size, your case will have to be hand-fed into the chamber in exactly the same "o'clock" position every time to be effective. I do it with a few of my commercial rifles with some success. 7.5 Swiss? Forget it. Its an exercise in futility that won't shade my loads anyway, and there are at least two local k31 owners that are now believers.
My credentials? 42 years of reloading and 32 of those devoted to the 7.5 Swiss cartridge."


I've been reading stuff all afternoon and one of the things that came out of it is the other sizing dies for bottleneck cases I have are all Forster. Forster dies are set up with the expander ball doing it's work just above the stroke bottom on the press to give a person maximum mechanical advantage. This Hornady die had me encountering the resistance a little better than half way up the upstroke. So that's a difference.

I also noticed that the people who complained about this kind of thing happening to them frequently had Lee/Hornady dies. Makes me think there's some differences in measurements/tolerances between all the brands.

I still need to pull the ball out and inspect, polish, clean...that can't hurt anything anyway. I was planning to polish it chucked in a drill with brass wool and rubbing compound.
 
Jimbob78 said:
One option here would be turning the necks down to make them thinner if you didn’t want to go the bushing die route.
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How does a person do that? Need a lathe?
 
So look at the difference in the expander between the dies. Hornady left, Forster right.

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Run a piece of brass through, then on a separate piece, take the stem out and run a piece through. Measure the necks of each.
 
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Timfoilhat said:
How does a person do that? Need a lathe?
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Forster makes neck turner, RCBS, 21st, several manufacturers, there are also inside neck reamers, when you go to form cases. Example would be 30 Herrett from a 30-30 Win case, form, trim, and ream the inside.
I replaced most of my common expander."buttons" with Carbide one from CH Tool and Die (CH4D now) dont know if they still make them or sell em

-Snoopz
 
Before you go buying anything, take a Q-tip or old bore mop and put some lube on it. Run it into the neck, the entire length of the neck, before you size the case. I bet the expander will not offer as much resistance if it is lubed. A bit of mica in the case mouth may not be enough and would probably not be spread out over the whole inside of the neck as the expander plug is inserted.
 
Catfish said:
pull the expander and take a zoomed-in picture of it. Look for machine marks, etc. When I've had this problem polishing the expander solved it.
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I pulled this out today, chucked it in the drill and polished it with compound on a rag. Visually and tangibly smoother post polishing. I coated it with a bit of Imperial when done. Unfortunately, I don't have any brass to test it on until I shoot again.
The photos are all "before" pictures.

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I didnt read all the posts here but I load 3 calibers for benchrest competition and there is no expander on the stem. Quite the opposite, bushing squeezes the neck smaller. In my experience, expander balls like found on Forster dies, work the brass too much. No lube required inside the neck either. YMMV.
 
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I run bushing dies on most cases but I got one set of Hornady dies with a barrel and brass I bought. It seems like the Hornady expander is the worst I have encountered. I use unique lube on a q-tip to coat the inside neck walls and just below the shoulder. It really helped but still a bad design. If I had to use an expander, I would choose the floating carbide by Redding. Otherwise, the mandrel expanders are the way to go.
 
I just shot the K31 again over the weekend. Washed the brass yesterday. First one through the sizing/decap die was perfect, no more sticking. It was either that the previous brass was dirty, or polishing the expander worked like a charm.
 
Charlie said:
Before you go buying anything, take a Q-tip or old bore mop and put some lube on it. Run it into the neck, the entire length of the neck, before you size the case. I bet the expander will not offer as much resistance if it is lubed. A bit of mica in the case mouth may not be enough and would probably not be spread out over the whole inside of the neck as the expander plug is inserted.
Click to expand...
I use the Q-tip and Dillon spray case lube. Squirt a 9mm case full and dip the Q-tip in and swab the entire length of the neck. Works like a charm.
 
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