STOP THE BLEED class: a follow-up

Mrs Hawgbonz

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Hawgbonz and I went to the 1-hour class yesterday, and I felt very compelled to write this! :)

All I can say is THANK YOU to those who mentioned the class....I learned an AMAZING amount of stuff considering that I thought I had a pretty solid background in trauma medicine, and my outlook has changed. I still would advocate for proper training, but even that is less of a concern after the class. "Old school" medical training always said that after 2 hours with a tourniquet, a person is as likely as not to lose a limb or at least sustain significant nerve/tissue damage just from the tourniquet. I had a concern that someone might think something is a "lot of blood" and apply a tourniquet that wasn't necessary and that the person with the tourniquet on would start to suffer tissue damage before they could even get to an appropriately higher level of care. She said that current knowledge shows that tissue damage doesn't occur for close to 8 hours if then. I had previously been adamantly against Hawgbonz carrying a tourniquet, exactly because a lot of non-medical people are quite impressed by what is truly not a lot of blood, and given where his hunt camp is, he'd likely be well outside of that 2-hour window that was in my head. After the class yesterday, I am all for it. He even got to practice self-application of a tourniquet, and we talked on the way home about which types were easiest for him to apply.

Another thing he had always said that I kind of pooh-poohed as not helpful was what to do if one didn't have a medical kit/gauze or 4x4s with them. He said he always has "necessary paper" (i.e., paper towels that serve multiple purposes), and I said that I didn't think that would be a good idea to use if he were ever in a situation because it is not designed to maintain its shape when wet, and it would be difficult to put an adequate amount of pressure on using paper towels. Now I know that while it's true that paper towels wouldn't be optimum, it's any port in a storm, and if that's what you have, that's what you'd use.

Overall, despite it only being a one-hour class, it was truly eye-opening and changed my perspective dramatically. Thank you to those who took the time on our previous thread to mention the class...very much appreciated.
 
I enjoyed the class a lot. It was a fairly small gathering and seemed like everybody got to do what concerned them.
Def lookin forward to s'more training classes! 🤠
 
Hawgbonz and I went to the 1-hour class yesterday, and I felt very compelled to write this! :)

All I can say is THANK YOU to those who mentioned the class....I learned an AMAZING amount of stuff considering that I thought I had a pretty solid background in trauma medicine, and my outlook has changed. I still would advocate for proper training, but even that is less of a concern after the class. "Old school" medical training always said that after 2 hours with a tourniquet, a person is as likely as not to lose a limb or at least sustain significant nerve/tissue damage just from the tourniquet. I had a concern that someone might think something is a "lot of blood" and apply a tourniquet that wasn't necessary and that the person with the tourniquet on would start to suffer tissue damage before they could even get to an appropriately higher level of care. She said that current knowledge shows that tissue damage doesn't occur for close to 8 hours if then. I had previously been adamantly against Hawgbonz carrying a tourniquet, exactly because a lot of non-medical people are quite impressed by what is truly not a lot of blood, and given where his hunt camp is, he'd likely be well outside of that 2-hour window that was in my head. After the class yesterday, I am all for it. He even got to practice self-application of a tourniquet, and we talked on the way home about which types were easiest for him to apply.

Another thing he had always said that I kind of pooh-poohed as not helpful was what to do if one didn't have a medical kit/gauze or 4x4s with them. He said he always has "necessary paper" (i.e., paper towels that serve multiple purposes), and I said that I didn't think that would be a good idea to use if he were ever in a situation because it is not designed to maintain its shape when wet, and it would be difficult to put an adequate amount of pressure on using paper towels. Now I know that while it's true that paper towels wouldn't be optimum, it's any port in a storm, and if that's what you have, that's what you'd use.

Overall, despite it only being a one-hour class, it was truly eye-opening and changed my perspective dramatically. Thank you to those who took the time on our previous thread to mention the class...very much appreciated.

I spent 10 years as a civilian medic, 5 of that in north city Saint Louis. I've cared for a lot of GSWs - so much so that we'd routinely get Air Force C-STARS ride alongs assigned to us for predeployment training. At the time (about 15 years ago now) tourniquet use for GSWs was listed as contraindicated by our protocol. IIRC, with the only time we were "allowed" to use them was for amputations. I have, however, used a BP cuff as a half measure, and that works quite well when combined with direct pressure. All of my training and experience has been in areas where advanced care was available in <60 minutes - so I don't carry a tourniquet in my medical bag, only a couple of Israeli bandages. For wilderness care, or military medics, I'm sure this is a different story.
 
@Mrs Hawgbonz , I am very glad that the class was a paradigm shift for you. As you well know, trauma is simple: something's busted, you keep it from getting worse, OR fixes it. But contemporary treatment is evolving; what was standard of care just three years ago is now being taken out of policy and protocols for some things.

In an austere extended field care environment it's not unusual to have people with TQs for up to 18 hours with no sequalae to the affected extremity. Now there are caveats for sure: a crush injury that releases a lot of potassium can cause cardiac events, etc.

Hunting camps are great places to have kits with TQs because of the austere environment with prolonged care and extrication issues. As for self-application, really any of the CoTCCC-approved TQs will be fine.
 
Great to know. Just an FYI for those who don't know but Mrs hawgbonz is no stranger to the medical field so this means alot to hear her say what she said.
 
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