You want Constitutional Carry? Act Now

Random thoughts here…

First .. I’m all about Constitutional Carry, no problem with it. Win! Petition signed!

Next thought… if NC goes to Constitutional Carry, I am assuming that the CCP will go the way of the DoDo. If that happens, my next assumption is that the ATF will instantly send an email to FFLs to advise CCPs, regardless of exp date are null and void (like they did with PPPs), making it a requirement for a background check for every gun purchase through an FFL. That action would now leave the potential for every gun purchase to be “known / potentially registered”… where the current CCP allows for no background check requirement and leaves more anonymity on current handgun purchases and long guns (unless you buy multiple handguns within 5 business days).

Is Constitutional Carry a back door to registration?

Just mind rambling…
 
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Reactions: Me.
Me. said:
I don’t understand the whole “I’m afraid of gun registration thing”. That ship sailed a LONG time ago.

Especially if you are a member of a public gun forum, and buy gun-related stuff online.


If the Feds cared, they have the name and address of every active member on this forum.

As for buying new in a shop… how is a NICS check more registrationy than a 4473?
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Agreed on all points..

In regard to 4473 vs NICS check. The 4473 is never turned in (unless the FFL goes out of business) or seen (unless seen during an ATF audit) vs NICS checks, which is called in or typed into the NICS, where it could be potentially retained.
 
Pop N Shots said:
... if NC goes to Constitutional Carry, I am assuming that the CCP will go the way of the DoDo.
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In states that have CC, they still maintain their carry permit system for reciprocity.
You'd want yours here, so you could carry in states where you're not a resident.
 
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Pop N Shots said:
Random thoughts here…

First .. I’m all about Constitutional Carry, no problem with it. Win! Petition signed!

Next thought… if NC goes to Constitutional Carry, I am assuming that the CCP will go the way of the DoDo. If that happens, my next assumption is that the ATF will instantly send an email to FFLs to advise CCPs, regardless of exp date are null and void (like they did with PPPs), making it a requirement for a background check for every gun purchase through an FFL. That action would now leave the potential for every gun purchase to be “known / potentially registered”… where the current CCP allows for no background check requirement and leaves more anonymity on current handgun purchases and long guns (unless you buy multiple handguns within 5 business days).

Is Constitutional Carry a back door to registration?

Just mind rambling…
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You ought to quit assuming things and read the actual statute…

The intro paragraph clearly says they’ll keep the CHP (no such things as a CCP in NC)…just like every other state that has passed constitutional carry. The permits still exist for reciprocity reasons, and to skip NICS checks.

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Done
 
fishgutzy said:
Not at all shocked that there was a parade of CCW course instructors testifying to keep their mandated customer base.
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man i hate those kind of guys
I was called for my opinion/vote at a gun rights group where they were looking at "enhanced" carry licenses. where people who had taken certain extra classes/training/etc were exempt from the gun free zone laws. I would have been exempt, no question about it.
I still voted "no" because i don't believe in special people

I also don't believe in these ccw fudds saying that people NEED to take their classes. I've taken 2 and helped teach others: there is very little useful info in the state mandated minimum training
 
BigWaylon said:
You ought to quit assuming things and read the actual statute…

The intro paragraph clearly says they’ll keep the CHP (no such things as a CCP in NC)…just like every other state that has passed constitutional carry. The permits still exist for reciprocity reasons, and to skip NICS checks.

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Appreciate the reply and for pointing out that CHP is the official term, which is what is displayed on the NC permit. The good news is that the ATF, the industry, and the general populous accept CHP / CCP interchangeably (wrong or not)… and I can say that I have never been demerited nor have I been chastised by the ATF (the biggest sticklers) for writing CCP on the 4473 in lieu of CHP. So, I think it’s ok to use a term (while not official), that is understood in a general sense.

As for the statute and the intro paragraph, it mentions in lieu of a pistol purchase permit, which is non existent at this time.. needs to be removed or rewritten or updated with a strike through, to play the word game? Lawyers chime in…

In regard to my point about the CCP going the way of the dodo… Unless someone travels a lot and wants to retain reciprocity, what’s the chances that folks will pony up the extra $100-$200 (based on current CCP process) for the classes and permit fee, to get an actual CCP over the rightfully free CC? Look at the recent increase in handgun sales from folks holding out on principle and a $5 pistol permit process. The percent of CC will be disproportionate, resulting in background checks, which could be “tracked”.

Let’s take Texas for example. In 2020 they issued approximately 316,000 CHLs (Concealed Handgun License.. I think it actually displays License to Carry Handgun- Yup, Texas uses a different term than NC). Then only issued approximately 149,000 license in 2021, due to the implementation of CC on 9/1/2021. This is less than half of the previous year and the numbers dwindled further the following year.

I think the aforementioned sort of gives way to my thoughts that most (or at least half) will accept the CC and forgo the CCP, which increases the number of background checks conducted.

Also, to mention.. some CC states don’t automatically allow NICS checks to be skipped / bypassed when CCPs are issued. One that comes to mind is Alaska. Their CHPs actually indicate if the person carrying is NICS exempt or not (see pic)

Nonetheless, I had tossed this out as fodder for conversation and outside the box thinking.

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Pop N Shots said:
Random thoughts here…

First .. I’m all about Constitutional Carry, no problem with it. Win! Petition signed!

Next thought… if NC goes to Constitutional Carry, I am assuming that the CCP will go the way of the DoDo. If that happens, my next assumption is that the ATF will instantly send an email to FFLs to advise CCPs, regardless of exp date are null and void (like they did with PPPs), making it a requirement for a background check for every gun purchase through an FFL. That action would now leave the potential for every gun purchase to be “known / potentially registered”… where the current CCP allows for no background check requirement and leaves more anonymity on current handgun purchases and long guns (unless you buy multiple handguns within 5 business days).

Is Constitutional Carry a back door to registration?

Just mind rambling…
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CHP's are not going anywhere. There is an option, that probably wont go anywhere, to make a lifetime permit.
The reason we have to renew CHP every 5 years is because ATF require the background check be done every 5 years.
 
Pop N Shots said:
Agreed on all points..

In regard to 4473 vs NICS check. The 4473 is never turned in (unless the FFL goes out of business) or seen (unless seen during an ATF audit) vs NICS checks, which is called in or typed into the NICS, where it could be potentially retained.
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How many are still doing paper forms? Last purchase I saw was all computerized. And who do you think get's a copy?
 
Cricketdad said:
Have you caught ATF agents taking pics of the forms with going thru your books?
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My last audit was on 1/10/23. I was with them the whole time. Nice folks.. one agent was local and the other drive up to the Wake Forest area from Wilmington. At no point did they take any pics or ask any questions that seemed prying or suspicious. Also, I kept an ear out during their conversation between themselves and nothing seemed out of place. I keep my books and inventory tight, so no issues at all. I suspect they only take pics at other locations, to document ill findings, as they are not allowed to take the 4473 with them, and must document the infraction.
 
Pop N Shots said:
what’s the chances that folks will pony up the extra $100-$200 (based on current CCP process) for the classes and permit fee, to get an actual CCP over the rightfully free CC?
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I've got non-resident permits in 3 states that accept the NC permit anyway. Paid for the classes, took the tests, did finger prints / pictures / stool sample and everything, even keep up the renewals. Two of those states allow online renewals including updating pictures, you can do it all via an app on your phone. It's like they're actually wanting people to be able to easily get a permit vs. the douchfactory we have to visit in wake county.

I'm totally screwing up the stats and making it so it's harder to use words like "no one" or "everyone" or "always" or "never".
 
Jayne said:
I've got non-resident permits in 3 states that accept the NC permit anyway. Paid for the classes, took the tests, did finger prints / pictures / stool sample and everything, even keep up the renewals. Two of those states allow online renewals including updating pictures, you can do it all via an app on your phone. It's like they're actually wanting people to be able to easily get a permit vs. the douchfactory we have to visit in wake county.

I'm totally screwing up the stats and making it so it's harder to use words like "no one" or "everyone" or "always" or "never".
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You must have a Costanza Wallet, to be able to keep all those permits in there! 🙂

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Pop N Shots said:
You must have a Costanza Wallet, to be able to keep all those permits in there! 🙂
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I only carry the extras when I'm in those states... which admittedly hasn't been in a while.

I'm more of a CCW tourist, like those guys that collect state stickers on their RVs.
 
Jayne said:
I've got non-resident permits in 3 states that accept the NC permit anyway. Paid for the classes, took the tests, did finger prints / pictures / stool sample and everything, even keep up the renewals. Two of those states allow online renewals including updating pictures, you can do it all via an app on your phone. It's like they're actually wanting people to be able to easily get a permit vs. the douchfactory we have to visit in wake county.

I'm totally screwing up the stats and making it so it's harder to use words like "no one" or "everyone" or "always" or "never".
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I assume you can’t use one of them in NC to avoid NICS…is that a correct assumption?
 
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