5 rounds of .38 special or 10 rounds of .380?

rufrdr

rufrdr

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I've been carrying a Ruger LCP Max .380 with a 10 round magazine. It is flat and light and so far at the range has never malfunctioned. I also have a SW 442 .38 special that I bought for a yard snake gun as I work in the woods behind the house.

On a realistic basis I'll never do a successful combat reload of either piece in an amount of time to matter for most CC shootout scenarios, least of all the 442. Being left-handed means that both hands and my eyes are busy reloading the 442 whether strips or a speedloader are used. The LCP needs both hands of course but not to the extent of the 442. The 442 has a more potent round and isn't going to fail at the wrong time like a self loader may.

I've read that statistically 5 rounds are about all that are used in a non police shooting either because that's all that was needed or that's all the CC shooter had in his/her firearm.

So, your thoughts on the matter? Keep using the LCP or train up to use the 442?
 
I carried a 442 for a bit, and liked it, I just wasnt personally very accurate with it outside of bad breath range. But I never once felt undergunned with it. Then again, I moved up to a P365 because it wasnt grossly bigger and was 11 of 9mm.
 
I’d be more for capacity; in a self defense shooting, nerves are likely to be a huge factor and you never know how many bad guys or how many shots said bad guy is going to require to stop the threat
 
There are some real good responses up steam in reference to both handguns. Both have their pros and cons. I think both are capable rounds given the right ammunition. For discussion purposes let’s go back to what you said about your research.
rufrdr said:
I've read that statistically 5 rounds are about all that are used in a non police shooting either because that's all that was needed or that's all the CC shooter had in his/her firearm.
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Your research showed that statistically 5 rounds are about all that’s used. Just remember those statistics are averages. Which means some only used 1 round and other used a lot of rounds.

So the real question is are you comfortable with your odds that if you are involved in a shooting that you would be on the low side of the spectrum? For me, I have bad luck, and I don’t like playing the odds. I’ll go with the higher capacity when possible.

Edit to add: At the end of the day, it comes down to the 2 Ps. Placement and penetration. The placement aspect may impact your decision if you can’t accurately shoot the .380. Then you should go with the revolver.
 
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Check out some reliable resources such as Lucky Gunner, Paul Harrell and you will find out of short barrels there is very little ballistic difference between the two.
I carried and shot a 642 for quite a while and I found it a very hard gun to master. It does not help that I found it rather unpleasant to shoot even with light wadcutter reloads. I feel you would be handicapping yourself with a 642 where there are better choices you can train yourself to a higher standard with less effort. In a self defense situation being well trained is BY FAR more important than the cartridge you are firing.
So I vote for a .380 autoloader with a caveat that if you insist on a Ruger put enough rounds though it to prove its reliability as LCP’s have a very poor track record on reliability (at least until they have gone back to Ruger a few times). Yes, I am biased against Ruger.
 
Average Joe said:
For me, I have bad luck, and I don’t like playing the odds. I’ll go with the higher capacity when possible.
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Joe, I am prone to take things to the extreme....I carry 2 LCP Maxs every day...24 rounds total in the two guns....things I have heard from people I trust help me make decisions. Evan Marshall told me over 30 years ago....If you think you might need a gun before returning home, Take Two....Clint Smith says....I never talked to anybody that was in a gun fight that said they thought they had too much ammo...Ken Hackathorn said.....Murphy IS alive.
So I take two, not for capacity but because I am certain that no matter how hard I have trained for Over a Half Century, my performance will not be Near as good as my practice. Mechanical things tend to go Tits Up at the worst moment [think flashlights] now think Guns. I ain't workin' on a gun that stops, I'm pullin' another one.
My guns are loaded with Underwood 100 grainers at 1,000 FPS....NO, that does Not mean that I think YOU should do anything like I do..remember..

We Must All Seek Our Own Salvation......I think you have a valid question....I gave the best answer that I have. For at least 10 years I carried 2 .38 J frames and never felt undergunned.
 
There are a lot of factors more important than the ballistic difference between 38 and 380. I'm a fan of the snub nose revolver for super discreet carry and I like a double stack nine with an optic when it makes more sense.

A few questions to think on. Obviously, which one can you shoot better? Which one hides better on your body in your clothes? What is your most likely, most realistic threat? How about less likely but possible? If getting tackled is higher on that threat assessment, the revolver has real benefit. If engaging at any distance longer than a car length the increased round count may weigh in big time. Speaking of distance, if that's a likely issue you may want more than either of those guns offers. One of the big reasons I adopted the optic equipped Glock a dozen years back was occasional animal issues where I was then. The ability to hit a fox at 50 yards was outside my ability with a j frame.

While in principle it makes sense to have one carry and be good with it you may find that two different seasonal or situational options are right for you.
 
BatteryOaksBilly said:
Joe, I am prone to take things to the extreme....I carry 2 LCP Maxs every day...24 rounds total in the two guns....things I have heard from people I trust help me make decisions. Evan Marshall told me over 30 years ago....If you think you might need a gun before returning home, Take Two....Clint Smith says....I never talked to anybody that was in a gun fight that said they thought they had too much ammo...Ken Hackathorn said.....Murphy IS alive.
So I take two, not for capacity but because I am certain that no matter how hard I have trained for Over a Half Century, my performance will not be Near as good as my practice. Mechanical things tend to go Tits Up at the worst moment [think flashlights] now think Guns. I ain't workin' on a gun that stops, I'm pullin' another one.
My guns are loaded with Underwood 100 grainers at 1,000 FPS....NO, that does Not mean that I think YOU should do anything like I do..remember..

We Must All Seek Our Own Salvation......I think you have a valid question....I gave the best answer that I have. For at least 10 years I carried 2 .38 J frames and never felt undergunned.
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Well said Billy. I always carry 2 😁
 
So, to sum up the various responses and to adhere to @BatteryOaksBilly advice of having more than one gun for redundancy, the obvious answer is to carry both!
Then all your bases are covered and you'll have 15 rounds on tap, using a NY reload. :)
 
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"I’d carry the .38 just for reliability."

I have shot IDPA matches for many yrs and in that time, I have seen 2 revolvers jam. In both of those instances, it took a gunsmith or someone with smithing skills to unjam it. You wont get back in the fight with a jammed revolver by doing a "Tap, Rack, Bang!".
 
For me, when I step down to the 442 or LCP (I don't have a Max) it is often because I'm pocket carrying. Even though it is physically larger, the 442 doesn't print like what most people think of as a gun. Again, for me....

So 9 times out of 10 I roll with the .38. Stoked with standard pressure LSWC.
 
RR said:
For me, when I step down to the 442 or LCP (I don't have a Max) it is often because I'm pocket carrying. Even though it is physically larger, the 442 doesn't print like what most people think of as a gun. Again, for me....

So 9 times out of 10 I roll with the .38. Stoked with standard pressure LSWC.
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I only do pocket carry and in a sticky holster. My pants or shorts are usually so baggy that the outline of the holster doesn't stand out. When I do have the 442 it is standard velocity .38 soft points.

I tried carrying a 3913 9mm in a pancake holster and it was very uncomfortable, but it at least stopped me from slouching, the way it dug into my love handle!
 
snap cap said:
Quote:
"I’d carry the .38 just for reliability."

I have shot IDPA matches for many yrs and in that time, I have seen 2 revolvers jam. In both of those instances, it took a gunsmith or someone with smithing skills to unjam it. You wont get back in the fight with a jammed revolver by doing a "Tap, Rack, Bang!".
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It sort of depends on what has jammed the revolver up. The malfunction drill "tap-stroke" can sometimes free up the cylinder. And if the cylinder is shut and won't rotate you can use the heel of your right hand to try to pop the cylinder open. If the problem is something like a high primer, or some grit binding things up, or maybe even an ejector rod that has backed out a little bit, these kinds of immediate action drills can work. They can also damage the revolver, of course, so it may be a bad idea to smack your revolver around very much at a match. But since I think very few people actually get any real instruction on running revolvers, they are unlikely to know these solutions, and hence can assume the revolver needs a gunsmith when it really just needs a little heavy handed love to get working again. In a defensive situation, it's worth knowing how to deal with a jammed up revolver in ways that go beyond the simple-minded "just press the trigger again!" advice you're likely to get.

If we're comparing small revolvers to small autoloaders like the OP is asking about, I don't believe there is any doubt at all about which is more reliable. Small revolvers win that contest by a wide margin. Little bitty autoloaders like the LCP need a lot of attention to things like grip if they're going to work right.
 
You will never leave the LCP home because it is too big, heavy, or bulky . . . any gun you have is better than the one you don't . . . ballistics irrelevant on a nonexistent gun . . .
J frames aren't bad but LCP package cannot be beat for EDC size and weight.
 
Moylan said:
It sort of depends on what has jammed the revolver up. The malfunction drill "tap-stroke" can sometimes free up the cylinder. And if the cylinder is shut and won't rotate you can use the heel of your right hand to try to pop the cylinder open. If the problem is something like a high primer, or some grit binding things up, or maybe even an ejector rod that has backed out a little bit, these kinds of immediate action drills can work. They can also damage the revolver, of course, so it may be a bad idea to smack your revolver around very much at a match. But since I think very few people actually get any real instruction on running revolvers, they are unlikely to know these solutions, and hence can assume the revolver needs a gunsmith when it really just needs a little heavy handed love to get working again.
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Shot a lot of DAO PPC matches and have had both star extractor work loose and unburned powder under the star during ejection / reloading cause jams. But these are extreme competition examples, not everyday scenarios.

If you check the extractor rod occasionally at home [and/or Loctite it] and keep it clean under the star there is about a 99.99% reliability rate on a carry revolver [not including ammo issues.] Much better reliability vs any semiauto given the possible failure modes.
 
Moylan said:
don't believe there is any doubt at all about which is more reliable. Small revolvers win that contest by a wide margin
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I do not know how you quantify this statement, especially the “wide margin” comment which would (perhaps) indicate magnitudes of difference between the two.
On a theoretical level revolvers are more complex with more parts which theoretically would be less reliable (more parts more problems).
From my experience level over my time shooting both revolvers and ”self loaders” I have observed a few things:
I shoot revolvers much less per range session. Fewer shots per session may give a false impression they are more reliable .
When a revolver jams, it JAMS. There are no easily cleared jams.
Revolvers (especially pocket carrying) are very susceptible to fouling (and potential jamming) due to accumulation of pocket link, candy wrappers and such. This is especially true with exposed hammer revolvers where filth tends to get by the hammer into the lock work.
 
keepcalmandcarryon said:
Revolvers (especially pocket carrying) are very susceptible to fouling (and potential jamming) due to accumulation of pocket link, candy wrappers and such. This is especially true with exposed hammer revolvers where filth tends to get by the hammer into the lock work.
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OP mentions 442 with shrouded hammer - ideal for pocket carry sealed against debris.

Model 442 | Smith & Wesson

www.smith-wesson.com www.smith-wesson.com
 
380 vs 38
All I have to say is that I have never seen anyone to volunteer to get shot by either one.

Either round will work for self defense. Pick whichever handgun you shoot best with and that handles well for you.

You can't go wrong with having two like @BatteryOaksBilly and @Average Joe said.
 
cold1 said:
380 vs 38
All I have to say is that I have never seen anyone to volunteer to get shot by either one.

Either round will work for self defense. Pick whichever handgun you shoot best with and that handles well for you.

You can't go wrong with having two like @BatteryOaksBilly and @Average Joe said.
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One of each in two front pockets. Dilemma resolved !!
 
keepcalmandcarryon said:
I do not know how you quantify this statement, especially the “wide margin” comment which would (perhaps) indicate magnitudes of difference between the two.
On a theoretical level revolvers are more complex with more parts which theoretically would be less reliable (more parts more problems).
From my experience level over my time shooting both revolvers and ”self loaders” I have observed a few things:
I shoot revolvers much less per range session. Fewer shots per session may give a false impression they are more reliable .
When a revolver jams, it JAMS. There are no easily cleared jams.
Revolvers (especially pocket carrying) are very susceptible to fouling (and potential jamming) due to accumulation of pocket link, candy wrappers and such. This is especially true with exposed hammer revolvers where filth tends to get by the hammer into the lock work.
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I'm not comparing revolvers and autoloaders, I'm comparing small revolvers to small autoloaders, like the LCP Max the OP mentioned.

Yeah, a Glock 19 will run dry and dirty pretty reliably. Have you tried that with an LCP?

Yeah, a Glock 19 isn't super finicky about your grip on it when you fire. An LCP will malfunction on a limp wrist pretty reliably.

Etc.

Small autoloaders are just not as reliable as Glock 19-or larger autoloaders. And they're not as reliable as revolvers, either. But you're right, I can't quantify the statement in the sense of giving you some kind of equation to prove it. (BTW, I already addressed the point about "no easily cleared revolver jams." Just not true.)
 
Moylan said:
Yeah, a Glock 19 will run dry and dirty pretty reliably. Have you tried that with an LCP?
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I have carried both for long periods of time. I have carried 2 MAXs for over a year with shooting done weekly. I am amazed that anybody here would think I would carry Any gun that I was not sure of...that said.....I do carry 2.....Murphy is alive.
 
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