crumple it up a bunch of times until it gets soft like toilet paper.Got my letter. Not doing a damn thing about it. Moving on with my life.
âTalking to ATF has made things much clearer, reduced infringement and enhanced freedom and liberty for all Americans.âUpdate from a guy on ARF that spent more time on this than I wouldâveâŚ
Update: I got a call back from some one at the St Paul division office. I will try to get everything that we talked about in here, but it probably wonât be in order or word for word.
First things first. The agent stated that he talked with the lawyers at their division office and the guidance he was given was that they were not going to pursue the end users so long as they were obviously trying to follow the law. He further stated that as far as their division lawyers we concerned, if you had an approved form 1, they were accepting that as proof that you made a reasonable attempt to follow the law.
I broached the issue of the letter implying that items purchased from DM possibly should have been transferred on a form 4. He didnât confirm or deny a position on how potentially regulated items should have been transferred. He just restated that as long as you had an approved form 1, they were not going to press the issue.
I politely told him that vaguely worded letter that appeared to be a âshake out the couch cushionsâ type of operation like this was a reason that ATF struggles to get support from the law abiding gun owners of this country. He stated that this was meant to try to shake out people that were trying to circumvent the system and are not able to legally possess firearms. He also made the statement that the letter came from another division, and was likely sent to everyone that may have been a customer of DM. It didnât seem like he knew who purchased what, and if the division that sent the letter knows who purchased what, he didnât give any type of indication either way.
I asked about getting something in writing from them that a form 1 is acceptable. He said he would take it to their division lawyers. He also said that he totally understood why I would ask for something in writing and he would do the same if he were in my shoes. I asked what he thought the chances were that they would give me something in writing. He said probably 50/50 and I should check in if I donât hear from him in a couple of days.
I havenât received a letter, and nothing is showing in my FedEx app as far as one being in routeâŚjust some boots from Academy.
Your order was before he setup an account with stamps.com for shipping labels. When other offices have contacted the Detroit office they were told they didn't have order records, only email/addresses. Likely limits their chances to do anything other than get some parts voluntarily turned it, or to compare it with known felons and target a small group of the 4500 to follow up with.... I havenât received one.
Never forget the manufacturer creates the serial number out of the thin air and is recorded in the A&D log when the receiver is created.Lemme tell you this ATF story.
So earlier this week they call the shop. "we are doing a trace, and the individual XXX-XXXX bought a sig 365 and the serial number is incorrect. So we are all like "damn, we messed up......" check the A&D book, well......it's the same as she said it was on the multiple form we sent in, and it's the same on the 4473. WE call her back....tell her that. "Its not correct, that is NOT a Sig serial number..... well.... I don't know what to tell her. So we decide to call the customer, and have him read the serial number off the gun. He says wait....(as he pulls over). Reads serial number. Same on the 4473. Call her back..... "Its not the correct serial number, its not a Sig serial number". (WTAF) . So we call him back AGAIN and tell him to send a PICTURE of the serial number. She finally believes me. She "THOUGHT" it was an incorrect serial number because it started with a different number than usual?!?! I read an email from her later.....I don't think English was her first language.....it was horrible.
That went on over about 5 hours of back and forth. For nothing.
Lemme tell you this ATF story.
... <snip> ...
That went on over about 5 hours of back and forth. For nothing.
Some folks in my area have memories of a case of abc's questionable tactics that occurred a number of years ago. Even before that unfortunate episode, folks just wanted to be left alone, and that attitude has had an influence on local and State wide politics.
Recently one of the local sheriff's had addressed how their department responds to requests from abc's for their support in visiting someone that they would like to talk to. He clarified State laws regarding firearms accessories, as well as providing assistance to abc's.
Video length is 10:54
Wait until they start confiscating braced pistols and charging owners with NFA offenses for their unregistered SBR's. Gonna get real. The ATF is back.It could seem that way. However, they sort of shot themselves in the foot as a result of the Ruby Ridge fiasco.
I would love for somebody to prove this to be falseâŚbut word on the street is Chris was going to be sentenced today. Instead of letting that happen, he killed himself last night. đ˘
Chris was obviously a man of peace. Once the decision was made to exit this existence, many others in his situation would have determined to bring some traveling companions on the journey.
You're forgetting the fact that they ruined his life, took away his property, and somewhat limited his future prospects with a felony conviction.5 years? Thatâs it? Totally unrelated but federal sentences are in months, so 60 months. If it was life with no parole I can sort of understandâŚkind of.
But you earn good time in the feds and can get like 60 days (itâs somewhere around 50-60 days) of good time every 12 months so he couldâve done barely over 4 years and got out. Geez
F the ATF
taking other people along seems to be a favorite tactic of the left. he probably was not on that side of the aisle.Chris was obviously a man of peace. Once the decision was made to exit this existence, many others in his situation would have determined to bring some traveling companions on the journey.
This is why I never even in jest suggest people break federal firearms laws. I always get called a boot licker or whatever but they'll ruin your life over 200 bucks.
5 years? Thatâs it? Totally unrelated but federal sentences are in months, so 60 months. If it was life with no parole I can sort of understandâŚkind of.
But you earn good time in the feds and can get like 60 days (itâs somewhere around 50-60 days) of good time every 12 months so he couldâve done barely over 4 years and got out. Geez
F the ATF
Many life insurance policies have an exclusion for suicide.Might have wanted to leave his family with life insurance money instead of legal bills.
You're forgetting the fact that they ruined his life, took away his property, and somewhat limited his future prospects with a felony conviction.
you never know what somebody's breaking point is.
taking other people along seems to be a favorite tactic of the left. he probably was not on that side of the aisle.
Many life insurance policies have an exclusion for suicide.
all policies have a 2 year exclusion for suicide. after that, in NC, exclusions are illegal. No one has them and you could force them to pay even if they did have one.The ones we have/have had had a time after buying the policy that had a suicide exclusion and then they paid for death by suicide after that. At least one of them was two years.
@tanstaafl72555 - any comments on suicide exclusions for life insurance policies.