I hadnt realized how bad the gouging had gotten until yesterday

wired said:
Is your right to eat artichokes guaranteed in the constitution? This is equivalent to generators selling for $3000 after a storm. There are laws in place to stop that.
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Well get yourself right over to Josh Stein’s website and you can fill out a complaint for any gun store you like and see if he’ll inflict a $5000 fine as promised. I’ll even provide the link. https://ncdoj.gov/file-a-complaint/price-gouging/

But be sure it meets his requirement, which it doesn’t.

"Price gouging—or charging too much in times of crisis—is against North Carolina law when a disaster, an emergency or an abnormal market disruption for critical goods and services is declared or proclaimed by the Governor or a municipality."

*Edited out my tirade on economics challenged posters.*

Edit: I see you are in SC. Her ya go.
Get to it.

http://www.scag.gov/archives/36458#:~:text=The price gouging law (SC §39-5-145) is a,a $1,000 fine and/or 30 days in jail.
 
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wired said:
Had some time to kill yesterday before going in to work for a bit so I stopped by Hyatts in Charlotte . I dont think Ive ever bought anything there as their prices are always on the high side of ridiculous but I noticed they had .22lr on the shelf and at first I thought well, things must be getting better Nope. CCI standard velocity for $20 a box of 50. Yeah, the $4 stuff.
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And yet, you noticed "they had .22lr on the shelf". Which meant they at least HAD ammo on the shelf to sell.

Like it or not, you know what a business is that has no product on the shelf to sell?

Closed.

Let's say they slap that $4 price tag on it.

In this climate, it would be gone. And with little hope of getting more in any reasonable period of time.

As it stands now, if you NEED some .22 ammo, you know at least one place where you have a reasonably decent chance of getting some.
 
RetiredUSNChief said:
And yet, you noticed "they had .22lr on the shelf". Which meant they at least HAD ammo on the shelf to sell.

Like it or not, you know what a business is that has no product on the shelf to sell?

Closed.

Let's say they slap that $4 price tag on it.

In this climate, it would be gone. And with little hope of getting more in any reasonable period of time.

As it stands now, if you NEED some .22 ammo, you know at least one place where you have a reasonably decent chance of getting some.
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$29 a box now.
 
Question...

Do you NEED .22 ammo? Or do you WANT .22 ammo?

If you NEED .22 ammo, then pony up $20 (edit: now $29) and buy a box.

If you're not willing to do this, then I submit you actually fall in the WANT category.

Which means these prices actually have absolutely NO effect on your day-to-day life as you can simply go about your business and not buy any .22 ammo.

These high prices exist because CONSUMERS have created the conditions which caused them. Consumers have made a "run" on the ammo market and are quite literally buying up everything they can get their hands on, and doing so at a rate that far exceeds production capacity.

It's not a shortage created by something like an "act of God" (weather catastrophe or something).
 
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wired said:
In what way is it not the same?
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The current supply/demand issues have not been caused by a natural disaster.

There are a lot of new shooters out there wanting/needing ammo, just like those of us who have been shooting for years.

There have been disruptions in the supply chain for raw materials, due to the plandemic.

It is costing manufacturers more money to produce ammo/components, both in materials and man-hours. Manufacturers pass on that cost increase to distributors. Distributors pass their increase down to the dealers. It costs the dealers more money to keep product in stock. When their costs increase, they will pass that increase along to the consumers. Why? Because they run a business; just like the manufacturers and the distributors. The goal is to provide a product while making a profit. If they price items on the shelf at the same price it costs them, they will not stay in business very long.
 
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Dale Gribble said:
The current supply/demand issues have not been caused by a natural disaster.

There are a lot of new shooters out there wanting/needing ammo, just like those of us who have been shooting for years.

There have been disruptions in the supply chain for raw materials, due to the plandemic.

It is costing manufacturers more money to produce ammo/components, both in materials and man-hours. Manufacturers pass on that cost increase to distributors. Distributors pass their increase down to the dealers. It costs the dealers more money to keep product in stock. When their costs increase, they will pass that increase along to the consumers. Why? Because they run a business; just like the manufacturers and the distributors. The goal is to provide a product while making a profit. If they price items on the shelf at the same price it costs them, they will not stay in business very long.
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Add up the commodity price increases over the last two years. Its $3 per thousand rounds of 9mm.
 
I’d like to find CCI 41s at $40/1000, but I know that ain’t happening. I want those primers to load up some empty 5.56 cases I have. I do not “need” those primers, because the lack of them is not adversely affecting the safety/welfare of me or my loved ones.
 
wired said:
Add up the commodity price increases over the last two years. Its $3 per thousand rounds of 9mm.
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So you’re stating the manufacturers, distrubutors and dealer costs have not really increased that much over the last couple years?
 
Dale Gribble said:
I’d like to find CCI 41s at $40/1000, but I know that ain’t happening. I want those primers to load up some empty 5.56 cases I have. I do not “need” those primers, because the lack of them is not adversely affecting the safety/welfare of me or my loved ones.
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How are you going to maintain a well regulated militia?
 
Dale Gribble said:
So you’re stating the manufacturers, distrubutors and dealer costs have not really increased that much over the last couple years?
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I know a thing or two about supply chain yeah . Look at what the big box retailers are able to still put it on the shelf for. Yeah it lasts thirty seconds until the gunbroker resellers snatch it up but the prices are almost unchanged give a few percentage points over a year. That gives a indication of what its like at the wholesale level. Beyond that yeah, its profiteering.
 
wired said:
How are you going to maintain a well regulated militia?
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I haven’t missed a single opportunity to shoot in the past year unless I was busy doing something else. An immediate family member who works at a LGS asked me where i was finding ammo. I said, the same place it always is. M y closet.

I’m very well regulated.
 
It's capitalism at it's finest and I have no problem with it. The price is what the market will bear. It's their right as free Americans. On the other hand, I have the right to not buy at their price and too enjoy watching them going out of business in the future because I don't forget.:)
 
wired said:
I know a thing or two about supply chain yeah . Look at what the big box retailers are able to still put it on the shelf for. Yeah it lasts thirty seconds until the gunbroker resellers snatch it up but the prices are almost unchanged give a few percentage points over a year. That gives a indication of what its like at the wholesale level. Beyond that yeah, its profiteering.
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I would bet the big box retailers pay significantly less to the distributors than the LGS due to volume buying,...they may even be able to purchase straight from the manufacturer without going through a distributor.

Yeah...I can go to Speer’s website and buy a box of 9mm Lawman for $34 (when it’s available), but I guarantee you that’s not the same price Academy, Bass Pro or Cabelas pays for it.
 
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Dale Gribble said:
I would bet the big box retailers pay significantly less to the distributors than the LGS due to volume buying,...they may even be able to purchase straight from the manufacturer without going through a distributor.
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Face it. The LGS is making money right now per round. Not much because they cant get much but their margin is high. Very high. I spent 20 years as an 02/07 and have friends on the retail side. If they can get it their price hasnt gone up by more than 20%. They problem is their allocation has gone down.
 
Why did the prices for TP, hand sanitizers, ammo and guns not be frozen due to CV, I guess they only do that for hurricanes.
 
Button Pusher said:
Why did the prices for TP, hand sanitizers, ammo and guns not be frozen due to CV, I guess they only do that for hurricanes.
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Eggzactly.

The last time SC exercised that law to my knowledge was in the run-up, and during Hurricane Florence.
 
wired said:
Face it. The LGS is making money right now per round. Not much because they cant get much but their margin is high. Very high. I spent 20 years as an 02/07 and have friends on the retail side. If they can get it their price hasnt gone up by more than 20%. They problem is their allocation has gone down.
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Prices are what they are...folks can decide to pay them or not...it’s a choice and no one is forced to buy anything at a specific price.

As I stated before, I’d love to find CCI 41s at $40/1000, but I’ll tell you what I won’t do...be damned if I’ll pay $100 or more for a box of primers. Yeah...I want em, but not that bad.
 
Button Pusher said:
Why did the prices for TP, hand sanitizers, ammo and guns not be frozen due to CV, I guess they only do that for hurricanes.
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Because the government understands what happened. TP, hand sanitizer and Bullets were being HOARDED by stingy people. That's what cause store to he out of stock. That's what caused demand to go up. And increased demand usually causes an increase in price. COVID didn't cause the shortages. Greedy people did. That's not a "crisis" government will jump in to stop.

Never mind that the government doesn't see guns and ammo as critical supplies.
 
two fingers said:
Because the government understands what happened. TP, hand sanitizer and Bullets were being HOARDED by stingy people. That's what cause store to he out of stock. That's what caused demand to go up. And increased demand usually causes an increase in price. COVID didn't cause the shortages.
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I wouldn’t necessarily describe them as “stingy”.

Folks thought they might not be able to get certain items in the future like they did previously, so they started buying more than usual. See...that’s the problem with having “just enough” on hand to get you through until next week’s trip to WM, Lowes or Piggly Wiggly....it’s a losing proposition when demand increases.

Stocking up, or “hoarding” (as some folks like to call it) is not a new concept...older folks have been doing it for years, most likely, because they have weathered some hard times. Nowadays, most folks don’t see the value in doing that because they’re all about the “here and now”...”If I run out of TP, water, food, etc, I’ll just run to WM and get some more.” Well, what if there ain’t any more? Then, people start getting into fist fights over a case of water or ass paper. Why? Because they did not plan ahead and have extra stock on hand.

Folks that get pissed off over shortages and willing to lose their temper with others need to take a good, hard look in the mirror when they are looking for someone to blame...

It’s called forethought, planning, “saving for a rainy day”. Reminds me of what they teach in Driver’s Ed....”Don’t look 20 feet down the road, but 2000 feet.”
 
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wired said:
Face it. The LGS is making money right now per round. Not much because they cant get much but their margin is high. Very high. I spent 20 years as an 02/07 and have friends on the retail side. If they can get it their price hasnt gone up by more than 20%. They problem is their allocation has gone down.
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They ain't makin' squat.

What they ARE doing is keeping stock on their shelves.

I agree they would be making money hand over fist IF they could reliably obtain product in quantities and rates they could prior to the current run on the market AND if they could move their product at their current prices.

But they can't.

Higher prices aren't making them rich... it's keeping product on their shelves.
 
Dale Gribble said:
I wouldn’t necessarily describe them as “stingy”.

Folks thought they might not be able to get certain items in the future like they did previously, so they started buying more than usual. See...that’s the problem with having “just enough” on hand to get you through until next week’s trip to WM, Lowes or Piggly Wiggly....it’s a losing proposition when demand increases.

Stocking up, or “hoarding” (as some folks like to call it) is not a new concept...older folks have been doing it for years, most likely, because they have weathered some hard times. Nowadays, most folks don’t see the value in doing that because they’re all about the “here and now”...”If I run out of TP, water, food, etc, I’ll just run to WM and get some more.” Well, what if there ain’t any more? Then, people start getting into fist fights over a case of water or ass paper. Why? Because they did not plan ahead and have extra stock on hand.

Folks that get pissed off over shortages and willing to lose their temper with others need to take a good, hard look in the mirror when they are looking for someone to blame...

It’s called forethought, planning, “saving for a rainy day”. Reminds me of what they teach in Driver’s Ed....”Don’t look 20 feet down the road, but 2000 feet.”
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If you have 50 rolls of toilet paper, you are prepared. If you have 500 rolls, you are hoarding and part of the problem.

I don't know what the number is for any given caliber of ammo, but there's a number where you flip from prepared to hoarding, and part of the problem.
 
RetiredUSNChief said:
Let's say they slap that $4 price tag on it.

In this climate, it would be gone.
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Not only gone, but gone to be resold by somebody else for at least $15 or maybe as much as $25.


Know what they call a business owner who leaves all that money on the table?

Failed.



two fingers said:
I don't know what the number is for any given caliber of ammo, but there's a number where you flip from prepared to hoarding, and part of the problem.
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Are you in charge of deciding that? Or do we all post our inventories and take a vote on who has too much?



wired said:
Face it. The LGS is making money right now per round.
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You say that like it's a bad thing.



wired said:
I spent 20 years as an 02/07 and have friends on the retail side. If they can get it their price hasnt gone up by more than 20%. They problem is their allocation has gone down.
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And do you know how to control demand when supply is low? By increasing price.
 
GoWolfpack said:
Not only gone, but gone to be resold by somebody else for at least $15 or maybe as much as $25.


Know what they call a business owner who leaves all that money on the table?

Failed.





Are you in charge of deciding that? Or do we all post our inventories and take a vote on who has too much?





You say that like it's a bad thing.






And do you know how to control demand when supply is low? By increasing price.
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I never said I was in charge of anything. But there's a line. And hoarding is what's driving the shortages AND high prices of ammo. I'm not saying the government should do anything about it. I'm not offering any kind of opinion whatsoever about it. It is what it is. But the fact remains that if people weren't trying to stash thousands and thousands of rounds that they'll likely never shoit availability would he better and prices would he lower.

I'm not saying that's you. I have no idea how much ammo you have and frankly don't care.


Retract your claws. I'm not judging anyone. If you need an excuse to be offended this morning find it elsewhere. ;)
 
two fingers said:
I don't know what the number is for any given caliber of ammo, but there's a number where you flip from prepared to hoarding, and part of the problem.
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Some of us see this as just the opposite. We "hoarded" when supplies were ample and prices were cheap. Those that did not are now the panic buyers; buying everything they can get their hands on at double the prices they were not that long ago; driving the prices up and keeping inventory off the shelf. I and others haven't "had" to buy ammo for quite a while. I don't see "us" as the problem. If there's a lesson to be learned here it's be better prepared for the next cycle cause there surely will be one.
 
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You do not get to determine what someone needs. If I >need< 500 rolls of toilet paper, that is my business and I don’t have any moral or legal obligation to explain to you why. The same as I have zero moral or legal obligation to anyone to explain why I need a particular firearm. Anyone who claims to be able to determine another’s need is playing the leftist anti-gunners game and they are just too selfish to see it.

My family has 6 people...3 of which are girls. We use a >lot< of toilet paper. So if I found a good deal on TP, especially during a time of possible shortage then buying 500 rolls is not only the prudent thing to do, it’s the smart thing to do.

The 2nd doesn’t guaranty your armament. It guarantees that the >government< won’t stand in the way of your armament. It says absolutely nothing about the availability of arms and ammo through private enterprise.


Again, someone who didn’t see the writing on the wall and listen to people who for decades have been preaching “buy it cheap and stack it deep” crying because they apparently hate the free market and only want it to work when prices go down, not up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
High Assed Gun's didn't gain that name via good prices or customer service. They suck and have for years. I will not get into larry highassed's anti second ammendment stance either. I lump high assed guns in the exact same group as "cheaper than durt" aka "more expensive than gold". That said I watch who else is now jacking prices through the roof and who isn't. These days of insane ammo prices will not last and then when its time to purchase again those pecker heads will not be getting a dime of my $$$. I have not spent a dime with ctd or high ass guns since the last panic when they decided to follow the same tactic and never will buy another thing from either party.
 
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two fingers said:
Retract your claws. I'm not judging anyone. If you need an excuse to be offended this morning find it elsewhere. ;)
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When you use words like “greedy” to describe the possible behaviors of others here, expect to get a less than courteous reply.
 
fieldgrade said:
When you use words like “greedy” to describe the possible behaviors of others here, expect to get a less than courteous reply.
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I don't know how much ammo anyone here has, nor when they got it. I also said that I DON'T KNOW WHERE THE LINE IS.

English is my only language. But I have a pretty firm grasp on it. If you're offended by what I said, that's on you.
 
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